Defending your thesis is no joke. I've had friends crack up while preparing. It plays out like an episode of "Defend Your Life." In many cases you are defending your life. Your thesis is more than words on a page, it's a fundamental belief that you've been working towards for years. Everything learned and gained has had a part to play in the birth of that brief. So it can be gut wrenching and life altering when you find yourself at a loss in it's moment of reckoning.
Redditor u/dexMiloyev wanted to know about the times as a student when many of us were left.... stumped by asking.... Doctoral candidates who couldn't defend their thesis, what happened?In Bed
One of my colleagues in grad school didn't finish his dissertation. Our advisor moved universities and told him he wasn't invited.
My friend had a nervous breakdown from which he never recovered. His wife divorced him because he spent all day catatonic in bed for months, and they had two young children to take care of.
Remind me Later
I've only heard of one or two people who didn't pass in the 6 or so years I was in grad school. They just worked on whatever their committee said to expand on and re-did their defense at a later date. Your advisor really shouldn't let you get to the point where you're defending and there's a chance you won't pass. It's more common that people will Masters out or go ABD, but not outright fail.
20 Years Later....
In the early 1970s, my father was an Ed.D candidate, and his thesis was on the topic of self-pacing computerized instruction (at the high school level). He taught himself the Basic programming language and everything, and was quite confident of success.
His thesis was summarily rejected because "there will NEVER be computers in the classroom" other than postsecondary computer science curriculums.
20 years later computers were everywhere in our schools, and you could go to any big box store and buy educational software similar to what my father had envisioned.
The Thief
While in graduate school, a professor at my university came up with an idea to write his thesis on. He told his advisor, who basically laughed him out of the room and told him it was a ridiculous idea. A year later, he learned that his advisor had stolen his idea and written a paper on it to be published in a major scientific journal. The student (my current professor) then left the program in disgust and just finished with a master's instead. Pretty good physics professor though.
Eventually....
I knew a PhD student in Math who discovered halfway through her doctorate that the problem she was working on to get her PhD had just been solved by someone else. She was able to work with her advisor to find a way to make the work she applied to that problem be applicable to a similar one. She eventually earned her PhD.
dead to rights....
I have a friend who is a tenured professor at a major university. He submitted a proposal to a funding agency. He later discovered that the program manager had not only stolen his idea, but even reused substantial amounts of text from his proposal in a publication. It turned out that the same guy was in the process of being hired by my friend's university for a leadership role.
Even though he had the guy dead to rights, and my friend's position was fairly secure, the politics of the situation made him too fearful to mention it to anyone.
I can only imagine what might happen to a mere student who accused a professor of this kind of misconduct. The sad truth is, even if the student had unimpeachable evidence, I think a lot of people would choose to obstruct and bury it and destroy the student's life rather than burn a colleague.
Take 2....
We have a family friend who was in a PhD program that basically got disbanded. Like his advisor and several other faculty members got fired. I believe they ended up giving him two master's degrees, Which is nothing to sneeze at but he did the work for a PhD.
Not Passable....
From my experience in grad school, your committee is there every step along the way.
You cant even start until you have an approved thesis prospectus. In this structure, you know if you're ready to defend or not. A member of my cohort was told prior to her thesis defense that she wouldn't pass, so they rescheduled for later.
Frozen...
It's exceedingly rare to outright fail a defense as others have mentioned. One person in my department failed their final defense because they froze up and couldn't even answer the easiest questions from their committee. Most people I know of who didn't complete their defense either left voluntarily with master's degrees for various reasons or failed out for silly, preventable reasons like plagiarism or not turning in their written qualifying exams on time.
Really Fool?
Had a Chinese doctoral student in the program I worked for, who was intentionally putting off and screwing up his thesis process. He only had a student visa, and didn't want to go back to China.
Don't be Salty
I know a guy that eventually got his PhD, but it took extra work and encouragement. Poor guy. His adviser left for another university and forbid him from publishing like 2/3 of his work/data. He failed by trying to honor the former adviser's wishes; he was so depressed and going to just accept it. I was freaking livid, and so was everyone else with a graduate degree that heard about it. In the end he presented all his work, got his PhD, and left for a postdoc. His former adviser was told to pound sand. I'm still a little salty.
"all but defense"
OP, since you're an undergrad perhaps this is new: no competent advisor will let a student defend without meeting requirements. It would be a huge embarrassment for the advisor and committee to fail a candidate at the defense, because it implies they didn't do their supervisory job prior to the defense. Good advisors are invested in helping people in their group succeed.
Nevertheless, not everyone who starts the program will finish. People can drop out for every imaginable reason. From failing to meet the requirements for a PhD (e.g., not producing original work of substantial impact), to losing interest in the topic, medical problems, having problems with their advisor, getting an industry job, deciding to move...
For completeness: the impact of the original research and publications generated during the PhD are the key to a solid defense. Sometimes people put "all but defense" in their resume. This means they took classes and did not defend. But the point of a doctorate is not to take classes, but rather to contribute to the state of the art.
Cheers
I went to post grad school with a few who couldn't or who timed out. They are known as all but dissertation or ABD. They typically find work relating to their masters degree... or they bartend. Those are literally the top two options I've witnessed!
Years later...
The thesis directly opposed the main premise of the field at the time, the board had a political stake in preserving the status quo. Went to another school and they immediately were just like, yep, here's your PhD. Years later, the original school's board was found to be taking oil money on the side.
Just Fail
Failing the defence (or not being allowed to defend) happens, but rarely. What is far more common is failing the comprehensive exams that most PhD programs require. Comps usually happen before or around the time of proposal approval. They consist (for me at least) a reading list of c.260 books that you have to complete three written exams on and two oral exams. It's not uncommon to fail them and not be allowed to continue.
Upon Review....
Not me, but my friend at her quals. She walked in, and the committee said, "We've reviewed your work, and we can tell that you won't pass this. Therefore, we're not going to give it to you so that you don't have it on your records that you failed. Withdraw from the program."
I was crushed, and it wasn't even me.
Predictable...
Giving a serious answer here...
If your dissertation advisor is any good whatsoever, they will tell you when you are ready to defend and not allow you to defend until that point. For this reason, it is rare that a doctoral candidate ever fails to defend. The only times I have heard of it happening are when a student insists on defending even though their advisor says they are not ready, with predictable results.
I Made It...
I have always been a horrible procrastinator and did not have the demeanor to complete a PhD. Did great in the coursework first two years then failed out after the third year. Now I make a lot of money as a quant.
Give me my backpack...
There was a guy in my program before I started (early 2000's) that had ALL of his data on one flash drive. He lost it when his backpack was stolen. Rumour had it he almost committed suicide after loosing like 3 years of work. He never finished and I think he went into a trade. Probably makes more money this way so good on him.
In the Netherlands...
My grandfather did not have to defend his thesis because he did not have to make one. In the Netherlands one could do doctoral by defending a number of assertions/propositions in front of the professors. So a real oral exam. He studied law, so he had to make a list of about 60 topics in different fields of law (criminal, civil, bankruptcy, merchant, sea etc.) like e.g. 'victims of violence have enough/not enough ways of getting compensation' and was questioned in depth about those. Apparently he did well, got the doctorate, and 25 years later Leiden University gave him a special diploma commemorating his doctorate.
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Sometimes you only need to experience something once, to know it's a never again situation.
I always say, try everything once.
Well, now that I'm older, a caveat to that is... try it all within reason.
How many things have we all walked away from saying the one time experience will suffice?
In fact, knowing when to say no is one of life's wisest choices.
Redditor Croakied wanted to discuss the times we've all said... "once was enough!" They asked:
"What is one thing that you will NEVER do again?"
Love. Did it. A few times. Moving on.
Stay Still
"Jump off a moving train."
DenseDriver6477
"My dad used to jump on a train when he was little to go to school. He broke his nose like twice doing it. He also would not recommend."
Darphon
“vaportini”
"Smoke alcohol. Me and my friends bought something called a 'vaportini' in college where you could pour alcohol into a bulb and after low heat separated the alcohol from the liquid, you could inhale it thru the glass straw you inserted into the bulb. Basically you got drunk directly into your bloodstream/brain and it never hit your stomach."
"If you did too much, your body wouldn’t make you vomit or something, there wouldn’t be a simple self regulation/safety measure. You’d just get alcohol poisoning. Felt very dangerous, the drunk wasn’t a regular drunk feeling. We used it once and were like okay, never again. I’d be surprised if you could still buy it, although it would be incredibly easy to replicate at home."
michelangelho
It’s heartbreaking...
"Fall in love with a drug addict."
Rains_Lee
"Good call, don’t do it. The drugs will always come first. Can’t go out unless their 'ok' with how much drugs they have and money left over if any, cant make love unless they have their fix for the night and even still it never feels normal, can’t trust them after the lies to get drugs and the manipulation they put you through, and you can’t change them no matter how much you try and wish they would. It’s heartbreaking."
Cvilla411
More me time...
"Give up my life for work. F**k going the extra mile for a place that doesn't value you and pays you crap even though you go the extra mile for them. You have 1 life with only so much precious time to enjoy it and slaving away at some job is not worth it. Do what you can to reduce your workload and find better employment, or hell try to change the working conditions at your current job to improve things for everyone if you can."
Mrhappytrigers
Well Obvi...
"Donate a kidney."
ToffieMonster
"Well, you could donate the remaining one. You just won’t be around to say anything about it."
shavemejesus
This is definitely list I can relate to. No thank you on a lot of this!
I Quit
"Smoke cigarettes, it's been two years since I quit."
SuvenPan
Forget It
"Climb mount Kilimanjaro. Toughest thing I've done and it's not worth it. I'm all about tough treks and camping but to put yourself under tough conditions and suspectable to altitude sickness only to get to the top for 10 minutes for a picture. No thank you."
Monks_
"I agree, it was memorable. Once was enough for my husband and I. Thankfully we stayed at American style hotel run by the US Navy with a hot tub and bar. Alcohol was definitely needed after all that."
Whatsherface112
I'm living alone!
"Sign a lease with a stranger without hanging out with them a few times beforehand. My past roommate experiences in college were terrible. Roommates either ignored me, hosted parties til 3 AM on weeknights, made the house the hangout and drug-den for them and their buddies. Meet up once and they'll put on an act for you. If you can, try to see how they act drunk or frustrated."
"Try to hang out with their buddies too so you can see the type of people who could be coming into your future place of residence. As soon as I can afford it, I'm living alone! Now, I investigate a potential roommate's social media and hang out at least twice before signing a lease with them."
fleursdefer
Stay Away
"Take back a cheater. Know your worth my brothers and sisters."
santichrist
"Ughhhhh going back and forth on this one. My boyfriend of 5 years has cheated on me. Several times, actually but says he’s really changed and is ready to settle down and wants me to move in with him. I’m on the fence. So they never change???"
madlecroy
Sleeptime
"Take a laxative and sleeping pill at the same time."
karmaredemption
Once, twice, three times... I'm out. Bye.
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People Imagine How They'd React If Their Significant Other Wanted To Sleep With Other People
There is an age old question that has been getting more traction surrounding sex for partners the last decade or so.
And that is... "is just one enough?"
Were we really meant to only be with one person forever?
There are so many flavors to taste.
What if your partner wants more cookie dough with your strawberry?
Redditor Pineapple-Status wanted to hear everyone's thoughts on opening the bedroom to others. They asked:
"What would you do if your long term SO suddenly wants to have sex with other people?"
I say I'd be ok with it, but I'm remembering my last relationship and I feel like I'm not a "put my $ where my mouth is type" on this issue.
Bye
"Wish her well and spend the next 2 years getting myself back to a place where I am ready to get hurt again."
wickedblight
It's Time to Roll On...
"Personally I would leave them."
"I think they're the ones leaving you. I don't think the relationship changes at that point; I think it ends. If you have a monogamous relationship, they are telling you they want to end that. They might be suggesting starting a new, non-monogamous relationship, but that is a separate thing. The original relationship is over."
octopoddle
ethical non-monogamy...
"OP, it's no different than anything else they want: you either agree and stay together, disagree but stay together, disagree and break up, or even agree and break up. What you're talking about is called 'ethical non-monogamy.'" The seminal book to read is called The Ethical Sl*t."
"It basically boils down to be whatever you want, just don't lie about it. The tricky thing is that this is something that was not present before, but is present now. So it's a potential fork in your road. If you're against it, it's up to your SO to decide if sex with other people is more important to them than a life with you."
Tokugawa
a different story...
"I think it depends too how intently they're interested. If it's a thing they bring up because they're curious but it's not a dealbreaker for them, I'm fine with that even if I don't want to proceed. A solid relationship involves open communication, and it'd make me happy if my partner trusted us and our bond enough to voice that curiosity with me."
"If it's something their heart's absolutely set on, then it's a different story. Either way, it's kind of strange to me how these posts always assume simply asking your partner how they feel about opening the relationship means they're now wholey invested in the poly lifestyle and they'll resent you or cheat if you say no."
donkeynique
Others
"Happy that we have common interest, sad that it's different 'other people."
i_lick_icicles
Sex is always an issue. Remember when it was just fun?
Mine
"Leave her. I’m far too possessive and jealous to be able to mentally accept polyamory. If she has a desire to be with other people I’m not going to stand in her way but I’m not going to be there when she gets home either."
Thiek
Not Me...
"Break up. My parents were poly and it's just not for me. I've been honest with every relationship I've been in that I'm not interested in any type of open relationship. If they want to be with someone else that's fine but we'll be over. My husband is aware of this and on board (and has been for over twenty years!). So if he came to me with this yes I would be heartbroken but I'm not willing to budge on this and it would be the end of our relationship."
GoldDustWitchQueen
Let's Talk
"Counseling time! We're married. I'm chronically ill (stage 4 breast cancer) and have no libido. We try to make intimacy work, and obviously in that case it wouldn't be working. So. Time for a pro to sort out the marriage, and possibly a sex therapist for me."
insertcaffeine
Awkward Positions
"I’ll put myself hypothetically in this position. My partner and I only want each other. We’ve made this abundantly clear to each other. However, if she came to me with desire to open our bedroom and she wanted to sleep with people outside our marriage."
"I would simply express how I vehemently do not an open bedroom and that it would kill any desire I have to want her, be with her, love her, etc. Our couple dynamic has been working well through our ups and downs. Involving some stranger in the ONE thing I find most sacred with my partner is the best way for me to lose any interest or passion for the relationship."
RedFlaim
Farewell
"Break it off, because they definitely already have someone in mind and you telling them no won't change the fact that they were only one step away from following through with it."
Caressticles
Well it feels like a lot of people still believe in one partner, happily ever after. Good for y'all. But big props to these couples who have open and honest conversations about their wants and needs.
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Many of us sometimes fantasize about what we would do to our worst enemies, especially in the moments when they're actively making our lives worse.
While most of us would never actually do any of the things that we contemplate instead of screaming at that super annoying person at the office, we do get pretty creative with the ideas.
Redditor take_me_there_ asked:
"What WOULD you wish on your worst enemy?"
This One Would Hurt
"A conscience. Let her realize the horrific things she’s done."
- Jenny010137
"Seriously. Introspection, self awareness, and empathy are traits that would improve a lot of sh*tty people."
- el_muerte17
"Oh I wish I had thought of this one. If my enemy had a conscience, wow life would be much different."
- Shelbysouth43
No Pearly Whites For You
"I’d like all their teeth to turn really yellow and stay yellow no matter what they do."
- toothfixingfiend
"What did I ever do to you?"
- Spideredd
"I don't even know you! Give me back my enamel!"
- AngryMustache9
Everything You Own Is Orange Now
"Permanent Cheeto fingers. Just orange cheese dust getting on everything."
- cocoapuff1721
"This has to be one of the most evil things I ever heard, yet absolutely hilarious."
-Merk0411
"The Midas Touch: Snack Edition"
- MaryVenetia
Ouch, But Forever
"Stubbing and breaking their toe and right as it’s about to be done healing it happens again over and over for the rest of their pitiful time on this hell we call earth."
- No-Bee-2971
"Sisyphoot"
- Alpha_6
"More of a Toemetheus imo"
- PykeTheDrowned
Self Reflection
"For them to realize how big of an a-hole they are."
- mayhemanaged
"Same for me. The trouble is mine probably knows what a tremendous a-hole he is, and just doesn't care (it's what defines him, is his outlook more than likely), so, give mine a conscience as well, he undeniably lacks one."
- RhoadsOfRock
"a crushing moment of self realization is something that can destroy you mentally. I wish that on them."
- chancetodream
Bury Them Under A Mountain Of Minor Inconveniences
"Always being hungry two hours after eating no matter how large the meal. Slow internet. Traffic jams no matter the location. Self doubt. Allergies. Favorite shows spoiled."
"Nothing major enough to be life altering but constant, low grade inconveniences that wear on your soul every day."
- I_Love_Small_Br**sts
"Every bite of food they eat/drink they drink being slightly the wrong temperature."
"Coffee? Warm but not hot. Cola? Cool, but not cold. Muffin? Ever so slightly frozen."
"Not enough to ruin their life, but just enough to not quite have full enjoyment of anything.."
- HappiHappiHappi
They'll Never Be Able To Use Their Computer Again
"Quick scan with McAfee on their computer."
- halflife_3
"You f**king monster."
- Orion_2kTC
"The constant pop-ups from McAfee is too far."
- _Land_Rover_Series_3
That's A New Level Of Evil
"Bed bugs."
- thrawn1825
"Currently dealing with bed bugs, and I can absolutely confirm this is the kind of thing I would wish upon my worst enemy. It is miserable and painful, and I've tried everything to get rid of them at this point."
"I would easily wish this upon my worst enemy, x10."
- ArbitrarilyStagnant
"Oh hell no, you went there... Hopefully they aren't living in an apartment complex or you've cursed everyone in the building."
- expect_less
Well of course I know him. He’s me.
"$100,000. I sure could use it."
- Sparklesperson
"'It’s no surprise to me I am my own worst enemy'"
- FishyVonFishenHymer
"Lol I thought this was that deep sh*t like 'pray for those you resent to have all the things you want in life….' Then I realized."
- No-Chipmunk9527
Forever Constipated
"That they can never have a satisfying poop. They always feel like they have to go to the bathroom and when they do nothing comes."
- [User Deleted]
"Wow. That's evil. Always feeling the need to pee would be good (as in horrific) too."
- ipakookapi
We definitely don't recommend implementing any of these plans (not that most would actually be possible), but here's some new ideas for the next time you're stuck in a meeting with your most annoying coworker and need a little fantastical escape.
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I grew up poor, and I remember the little things that made me smile when we just happened to have enough that week.
The little things that a truly rich person would not think twice about.
Ah, the luxury of it.
What spells luxury for you?
Redditor ConAir161057 wanted to compare notes about the things in life that feel like items only money can buy. They asked:
"For people who grew up with little money, what always felt like a luxury?"
New clothes. I had so many hand me downs and thrift store clothes... new seemed like a dream.
Anxiety
"After growing up in a home where every unexpected problem was a financial emergency, my idea of wealthy became 'I just want enough money that if something breaks I don't get anxiety about how to deal with it.'"
Obiwan_ca_bl**me
Literature
"Getting to buy something from the scholastic book fair."
Rich*itch3232
"My school, at the end of it a bunch of books were 'donated' and then spread out on a table in the library. We all got to go pick one book. So even if kids didn’t get to purchase a book, in the end they had a chance to still get a book. It’s actually how I got my first Harry Potter book. Was a cool idea for any school staff or parents active in their kids’ schools."
glass_pillow
Christmas
"Getting new clothes at Christmas from relatives. I don't know if that is exactly a luxury or the kind of answer you are looking for, but we never had a lot of money when I was in middle school. I went an entire year wearing the same pants everyday. The funny thing was my parents didn't even buy them for me."
"I got them for Christmas from my Grandparents. All the kids use to give me so much sh*t for wearing the same pants everyday. I always told them that I had 5 of the same pair which made me feel good inside and kind of made them ease off even though I know they didn't believe me."
"I remember I fell on the school bus one day and the jagged floor cut a hole right in the knee cap and the panic that went over me was just insane. It was one of the worst feelings of my whole life because I knew that I didn't have any other pants to wear and that now all of the kids in my school were going to know that I only had 1 pair. Needless to say I could not wait for the last month of school to end."
themagicman_1231
I'm Away
"Summer camp, or basically any school trips that had to be paid for. At my school the kids who couldn't afford to go on trips that happened during school hours still had to come to the school, we just sat in a room and did extra work like it was detention."
Helpful_Yams
"I was lucky. If you taught at the day camp your kid could go for free. That was just day camp though not sleepaway camp. My mom found a camp teacher who had no kids of his own and he signed me up as his kid so I could get free day camp. Did that all through elementary school."
randtcouple
Big Deals
"Going out for pizza was a big deal. Those free mini pizzas for reading books were huge."
Shroom4Yoshi
Food is always an issue when you're broke.
Damage
"Being able to turn on the heat in the cold and pay a professional to fix damaged appliances, plumbing, and other issues."
Liggettef
Spoiled
"When my grandma would come pick me up and spoil me. My parents didn't have much money and were addicts so when my grandma would come get me I would come back with new clothes, video games, toys, etc. I used to think my grandma was rich but she actually just had a stable income."
nawlepen
"I was in this position when I was younger. I always thought my grandma had SO much money… but all she did was go to work everyday. Always made sure I had clothes and all my school supplies. I miss her pretty bad."
Keywork29
Water
"I am from a small island in the Pacific. While I mostly still take cold showers, I have always felt that a hot shower is the finest luxury one can experience. I had my first hot shower when I was 22 years old and I can never forget it."
FSMPIO
"This is the kind of luxury I think people take for granted, I always avoided showers in the winter as a kid since most of the time they where cold showers and the temperature here was around 12c° during those times."
PowerfullDio
Showerware
"Towels. Honestly, I was almost 10 When I realized people didn’t just put back on their dirty clothes after a shower because my family was so large (12 kids total including myself) and extremely poor. I thought towels were just for hotels or were maybe a prop on television. I went to a friends house and she asked for my help folding her towels. I remember laughing and thinking she must be rich."
"Long story short, I wasn’t sure which way to fold the towels, and begged my mom to buy them after I revealed that my friend, Simone, had them. She bought a box of used ones from a local auction and I walked around with them on my head feeling like a frigging empress after that, even though—-let’s be clear… these were second hand towels!"
shakezula1025
Or BK...
"Grew up poor and when I was a kid I used to think you were rich if you had a dishwasher and a millionaire if you had one of those refrigerators that have a button for ice. McDonalds was also a luxury, a couple times a year on our birthdays."
chinderellab*tch
Everyone should have access to all of these things. Why is life unfair?
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