We all know that companies will do whatever they can to save a buck and move it into profit instead. That is how many successful companies were able to rise. There comes a time however when the big redline of ethics is crossed and the cost savings turns into an issue of causing harm to others.
DuPont chemical was one such company that caused grievous harm to an untold number of people through corrupt business practices. A compound used in manufacturing their Teflon was found to cause cancer and other issues in rodents decades before they did the studies to show similar in humans. Thousands of people have been affected, drinking water contaminated, loss of live stock, and irreversible environmental damage has been done.
However, it took an extended period of time between worker complaints of the toxin and action being taken. Although there have been monetary payouts, the company still functions making their products today just now hiding as a subsidiary of the Dow Chemical Company (DowDuPont).
Sometimes the corporate corruption runs too deep to be fully resolved. Redditor Chillay_90 wanted to hear other workers all too common encounters with serious corruption.
They asked:
"What's the most corrupt thing you've witnessed your employer do?"
They fled the country…
“At the first company I worked at the general manager had all his personal expenses paid by the company. His wife also had a company credit card and was paid a salary but she didn't work. The company paid for things like their groceries, house mortgage, car payments and family vacations.”
“The kicker is he wasn't the owner of the company. He had a creative accountant that hid these expenses but the owners became suspicious and they hired an auditor. It took them about 4 years to figure it out. He was fired and his family fled the country so I am not sure what happened to him.” optoph
She was a Mc-A**hole…
“A few years ago I was working/living at a McDonald's in Oak Ridge, Tennessee. The area manager decided to ‘save’ the store so she became very... involved... in its day to day micromanagement. One payday morning she made an announcement that, because everyone kept coming in asking for their checks and bothering her, she would be giving them to us when she felt we deserved them.”
“I called the local Department of Labor, who referred me to the state, who referred me back to local, who then told me they just didn't care and weren't looking into it. It eventually resolved itself anyway when she handed checks out the next day.” twistedlemon732
Do not work for free!
“I've had a couple that try to pressure you to work off the clock, without actually asking you to do so in order not to get sued. Suckered some people into doing it, if they complained after the fact they got canned. And by that I mean they got all hours cut until they were forced to quit so they couldn't file for unemployment."
“I just made it clear I wasnt playing their games in the first place. First time they tried me I was like 'I n't that working off the clock?' And they were like 'ohhh no no, of course not! We're not asking that at all, just looking for volunteers!'"
"I can't volunteer. Do you want me to stay, clocked in, or go home since my shift is over?"
"Oh well... I suppose you can go home. We'll figure it out"
“Needless to say, they did not like me much after that and made working there a living hell. Cut my hours to low numbers, but not altogether. But I had already asked my old boss if they'd take me back, which they welcomed me back with open arms. Only reason I took the new job was they paid like, 3 bucks an hour more. But obvs not worth it if I'm expected to work for free." Reddittoxin
Warranty scam…
“I was a mechanic that found out that the company was not letting me fix customers cars that had oil leaks when the customers had paid for a 200k mile warranty. The manager would tell the service writer to say that the warranty company declined it and eventually started making me take a photo to him so that he could tell me that the leak wasn't bad enough to fix.”
“The customer paid for a warranty and the company wasn't holding up their end of the deal because it was costing them money. They are one of the most profitable car dealerships in my town and now have 3 dealerships and are expanding.” Idontgetitbrah
Stealing workers tips…
“I was working at a small brewery / bar, and caught the owner dipping into the tip jar at the end of big nights. It was a new place that just opened and was kind of struggling during the off season. We literally had a staff of two bartenders and the owners (husband and wife), so the bar staff would pool and split that days tips.”
“Come to find out that he was taking a cut of the tips because "he worked there too". When I confronted him, I explained that its actually a violation of the FLSA. In fact it's even an exact example listed as illegal things to do with tips. He argued that it was his right as owner and fired me, so I reported him to Dept of Labor.” Rustee_nail
Political and corporate corruption go hand and hand.
“I used to work at a place that was owned by an organization with some political affiliations. There was a rich Middle Eastern investor who owed my employer money. Literally millions from a contract that they simply never paid.”
“It was quite a sensitive issue and one that everyone really wanted to keep out of court. Some negotiations took place and the investor agreed to pay but in return, wanted a spot on the board. Everything was agreed, the guy would pay and then there would be a big party event, with some press, for his appointment to the board.”
“At any rate, a few weeks before this was supposed to happen, the head of my organization became very ill and needed surgery and was gone for several weeks...the big party where the investor would become a member of the board had to be delayed. It turns out, our big boss wasn't actually sick at all and did not need to have surgery.”
“Actually what happened was, the head of the organization that owned my employer was running for political office and was worried about the optics of the whole event (only being able to get this rich middle eastern dude to pay us what he owed by putting him on the board and granting him a bunch of power over the organization) and basically ordered our boss to feign a long illness that would require the event to be delayed until after the election.” mejok
“if they asked you to work extra they would delete hours…”
“Worked in a restaurant that didn't allow employees to work over 40 hours as they did not want to pay any overtime. Instead of you wanted to work extra or if they asked you to work extra they would delete hours off of your time card to keep it under 40. They always asked you when they did that in a kind of hush hushed way so it wasn't exactly without permission but I think it was bullsh*t all the same.” cloudstrife1191
“stolen a combined 400 hours from eight people…”
“Growing up my father always told me to save my pay stubs and time receipts. I ended up working a job in my early 20 's at an airport moving cars. I get my paycheck one day and i realize that it's not right.”
“So i do a little digging, and a lot of math, and i figure out that the company was taking hours from me. I ask around and it turns out that they were taking hours from literally everyone at the job site. After doing more math we figured out that over the six months we all worked together, the company had stolen a combined 400 hours from eight people.” 42spuuns
So you get fired for that?
“Had a job out of college selling yellow pages advertising. A big part of the job was just renewing the old adds in the book and we had to call each business to have them renew their ad.”
“But as the yellow pages book became more and more obsolete more customers would cancel their ads. So the company changed the policy of having us call each business and instead put in a policy that any customer who didn't specifically call to cancel would be auto renewed.”
“Then they would purposefully send out the renewal notices late enough that the customers couldn't cancel in time to avoid the following years charges. If one of us did actually get a call from a customer looking to cancel and with time to legitimately do so and we actually cancelled them....fired.” totspur1982
Strangest Things Seen In A Contract's Terms And Conditions | George Takei’s Oh Myyy
Knowingly exposed their workers to asbestos…
“I work underground in the mines. One place started having, what the workers found out later, was asbestos type rock in the ore. The company took samples of it and then said it's kind of like asbestos, but it's not old enough to harm you.”
“Later after a bit of more concern from the workers, it was found out that the sample they took came back as inconclusive due to something else. They lied and allowed their workforce exposure to asbestos. I quit after that and found work elsewhere.” Chillay_90
Part of the healthcare conspiracy…
“Work for hospital, largest healthcare co. In that area. There was a situation where a doctor was involved in a law suit and I had to testify to some stuff. At the attorney's office I observed that THE ELECTRONIC MEDICAL RECORD OF THE PATIENT HAD BEEN ALTERED COMPLETELY. Everyone's notes had been changed. Scared the sh*t out of me. I realized then that no one really has any power except the corporation itself.” mxrichar
Some manual planned obsolescence…
“I worked for a pump company, We repaired all kinds of liquid pumps, from the little sump pumps you drain your basement with to the 2000 gallon per minute sewage pumps.”
“I was rebuilding one of the large pumps and the boss came in as I was assembling it, he came over to the bench and picked up the main bearings and took the seals off of the bearings. Essentially, it keeps trash out of the bearings to extend bearing life.”
“ He looked at me and said, ‘The warranty for a repair is 18 months, that's how long these bearings have to last. I buy the ones with the seals in them because they're cheaper and they look good on a itemized bill. So if these bearings last for 20-36 months, I'm losing money. Pull the seals out of these before you install them.’ I never did, f**k that guy. He was a piece of sh*t on so many different levels as well.” JomadicallyWondering
They missed the part in the Bible about giving away their riches…
“Worked for a Christian ministry that was fully funded by donations and run by volunteers who had to raise their own support. The CEO used donated funds to take his family overseas for vacations, to purchase 50% of a new vehicle whenever he wanted, to pay for golf trips for himself and his friends whenever he felt like it, and to help his children (who were also at the ministry) with house payments. Also forced the volunteers in the evenings to do childcare for his grandkids so that he and his children could go out to lavish dinners on the ministry.” GandalfsFavDwarf
Racism in the workplace…
“My first promotion at my first job included interviewing applicants if the manager needed help and I jumped at the opportunity (which should have been a red flag for a 30+ manager giving an 18-year-old that kind of early responsibility). It was sales and according to her she hired almost everybody 'but if you need to make choices, I tend to skip the black people because they don't do good in sales and don't know that many people'."
“I was f**king speechless, I didn't know what to say though and was afraid of losing my first job. At first, I thought maybe it was a really racist bad joke because English is not my first language but that b*tch was dead serious. I just picked up my materials and set up but I eventually quit and reported her to the corporate offices and BBB after hiring every person that came in for a job that week." s-p-a-r-k-e-r
“we had all been being poisoned…”
“I worked in a restaurant and an employee began having breathing problems on shift. She went to the ER and was diagnosed with carbon monoxide poisoning.”
“The owner didn't think it was from the restaurant (despite the fact that the employee was on shift for five hours and went straight to ER) but after several weeks of complaints from this employee decided to put up a CO detector. She put it out on Saturday morning at open and two hours into the shift the alarm went off.”
“She picked it up and rushed it into the back stating that it was malfunctioning. She refused to put it back out. Two weeks later and everyone was getting sick while at work. The owner denied that anything was wrong and refused to acknowledge that employees were getting sick.”
“I called OSHA and after an inspection it was determined that the HVAC unit was pumping CO into the restaurant and we had all been being poisoned. The owner was very upset that she had to pay to fix the heating unit and "couldn't believe someone would do that to me" (call OSHA).” noh8tred
“got shocked by 220 volts a few times…”
Shocked Ash Ketchum GIF by Pokémon
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“I worked for a signage company as an installer, some of the signs had LEDs and required the transformer to be connected to a mains cable. In South Africa its law that if you're dealing with electrics you have to be qualified, obviously no one that worked there was.”
“So like a dummy I just connected the main cable to the transformer for any signs I installed, and got shocked by 220 volts a few times, before I left I saw an invoice to a customer that I just installed a sign for, and the owner was charging the clients for a professional to do the electrician work. All the while I was doing it.” southafricabest
Profiting off illegal baby formula…
“When I was 20 I was working in a supermarket. At the time I was working there there was a global shortage of baby formula (milk powder.) The town where our store was located had a leading formula factory not even 5mins away. So we always had it in stock, and usually more than other stores. Even though we were only allowed to sell people one container at a time. So every once in a while I would walk back to where the freezers and loading area was.”
“And every so often there would be a van parked up by the open doors, where only trucks are allowed to load and unload the carts of products. The van arrived empty, and it left filled up with, you guessed it, baby formula. Followed by this driver wandering through the stockroom to the service desk and making two consecutive transactions because the maximum amount you could pay in one go was 2999.99. I think my boss's franchise was shady as hell.” Highway2022
Someone needed to call OSHA…
“I work in a MNC, and it is mandatory for each factory of the company around the world to share and report to HQ if there is any accident happen. In 2016, there was an accident happened where the finger of an operator was cut and bleeding previously, because the PPE implemented wasn't up to the standard for the task."
“Luckily it was flash wound and not an amputation injury. The factory treated and gave paid sick leave to this operator and reported this accident with action plans to prevent this from happening in the future."
“Few months later, a new plant Manager joined Mr. BA, started with our plant in 2016. He will soon be the most corrupt sob in the plant. Almost every year since 2016 there was at least one minor accident happened, and he will ask his subordinate, the HSE manager to keep quiet and not to report to anybody."
"Every single year he and the safety manager will proudly report to us all that the last accident was in 2016. There was an accident happened during Social Accountability audit, when the auditor was reviewing documents in the office."
"A maintenance guy's arm was sprayed by hot glue and got second degree burn, they will ask the maintenance guy to keep quiet, secretly go to ER, and come back to work the next day (as they don't want a loss time) and surprisingly, the maintenance guy follow this instruction."
"Another accident happened when an operator accidentally had his tip of a finger chopped off by a machine and also, no report. Until today, the factory proudly report every day, it has been 1800 more days since the last accident." beary12345
Higher Ed. had a lot to hide…
“I've worked in higher ed my entire career this far and particularly in some Ivy League schools so yikes I don't even know where to start…I can think of a few examples of students actual civil rights being violated and also someone embezzling over $100,000 from funds set aside for students with disabilities off the top of my head.”
“As corrupt as those things are though, they aren't the worst. I would argue that across the board in higher ed, the most corrupt thing is the coverup. The bigger the university, the more they try to hide these literal crimes to protect their reputations.” Ghostridethevolvo
Corruption everywhere…
“I have a few. I worked for a company who once took our Christmas bonuses and donated them to a family with a special needs child 'in our name'. We later found out that the mother of the special needs child was the cousin of the owner of our company but this was never disclosed to us by the owners. I don't mind giving to charity, but the way they went about this was super sketchy."
“Okay, last one. I had a side job with a small TV station and one day my paycheck bounced. I went to the owner, who claimed it was a mix-up and gave me cash. Then it happened again. I go to the HR girl who tells me that the owner of the station likes to gamble at the casino with the account used for paychecks. Quit then and there." AlanaDev
Perhaps the most concerning thing about these experiences, outside of victim impact, is the fact that most of these white collar type crimes are rarely or minimally prosecuted.
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When we're intoxicated, or even the slightest bit tipsy from having a little too much to drink, our immediate perspective on things is hazy.
But there's nothing like a bit of alarming news or a jarring incident to snap us out of the fog and focus on the moment.
Sometimes alcohol isn't always to blame for our impairment.
It can be a state of mind, like a perpetual numbness from being complacent in life, and all it takes is one shocking moment to rattle us back to our senses.
Curious to hear from strangers online about this type of scenario, Redditor Known_Challenge_7150 asked:
"What’s one thing that sobered you up real quick?"
These individuals were witness to shocking events that sobered them up right quick.
Bleeding Out
"Got out of a taxi and found a naked man profusely bleeding from his head crawling up the driveway in my condo. Called him an ambulance completely forgot I was absolutely wasted until 45 minutes later when I'd helped him translate and in to an amublance and stepped in my front door."
"Later a few days later learned he'd slipped in the tub and literally crawled out for help. Poor dude. He was fine but I genuinely thought he was going to die there."
– DongLaiCha
Tragic News
"At a bachelor party and we got a phone call that the groom’s father had suddenly passed."
– accountnameredacted
Bottom Of The Barrel
"I went to visit my parents back in July. I was homeless and deep into fentanyl addiction so I lost a lot of weight. My folks could see it. They knew something was up. Anyway, I spent the night and I was getting ready to leave in the morning and I looked at myself in the mirror for a good long time. I finally had enough and told them everything. They took me to detox, from there I went to rehab. Graduated in August and been living with them ever since then. I have 160 days clean and sober."
– Crotch-Monster
A reality check can be enough for some people to snap out of it.
Like Father, Like Son
"Was driving a drunk friend home, he had been on a bender again and was smart enough to call me for a lift rather than try and drive. As I helped in to his house his mother came down the stairs and said 'your as drunk as your father' and went back upstairs. I haven't seen him drunk since then, he still drinks but the thought of turning into his dad scared him out of hard drinking."
– psycospaz
Busted
"Flashing blue lights."
– FiddleOfGold
"This sobered me up just thinking about it."
– redmaple_syrup
Losing Sight
"Woke up to no sight in one eye. I had cataract surgery so just thought one of the lenses had slipped and it was an easy fix. Eye doc says nope, you had a stroke. I loved soy sauce, teriyaki sauce and salty food, which caused high blood pressure, which caused retina damage. Over six months was able to get most of my eyesight back with medication, and all back within a year. Trying to navigate life with one eye was very sobering. Started taking HBP much more seriously."
– MissHibernia
Quitting The Bottle
"Looked up someone I went to highschool with who was an awesome guy. Found out he had been dead for 3 years from alcoholism, at age 33. I made an overnight change. I hadn't started drinking that night yet, 10 months ago. Haven't touched it again since."
– omgtater
These disturbing moments were enough for Redditors to immediately come to their senses.
Unplanned House Guests
"Me and a buddy Woke up in someone’s living room, realized neither one of us knew the people, they were just nice and let 2 drunk guys sleep on their living room floor. We didn’t even say goodbye."
– Oneinsevenbillion75
Serious Health Warning
"Elevated liver enzymes."
"And the knowledge that this sh** was gonna kill me and I just couldn't orphan my family over it."
"So I opted for recovery, instead."
"Clean and sober since June 5, 2009."
– Far_Meal8674
The Joyride
"Grew up in a rural area. The little town hosted dances at the hockey arena, everyone (adults and kids) went and they overserved everyone, regardless of age. I was maybe 16 or 17 and was absolutely sh*tfaced, and jumped in the back of someone's truck with about 8 other people to go back to someone's cottage for after dance drinking. The driver (still don't know who it was) started racing one of his buddies and we whipped around small dirt roads, flying around blind corners on the wrong side of the road, going god knows how fast. It was basically a disaster waiting to happen. It was crazy scary and I was sober and thankful to be alive when we finally arrived."
– foxfood9116
The human psyche is a fascinating thing, isn't it?
How we can automatically focus on something urgent at a crucial time, even after getting buzzed from drinking too much alcohol.
But as we're in the thick of the holidays, it's a good reminder to drink responsibly and stay off the roads if you drive to your celebratory destination.
Cheers. Stay safe. And happy holidays.
We've all complained or vented about something in our lives which, in the grand scheme of things, wasn't exactly a problem, or is very easily solved.
Then there are those who complain about things that others almost hope will happen to them at some point in their lives.
These are known as "first world problems", as they are problems that pretty much only the world's one percent faces.
From having to fly business class instead of first class, or being served Roederer instead of Dom Pérignon, these complaints are often met with amusement, bewilderment, or even anger.
Redditor jennimackenzie was curious to hear the most absurd "first world problems" anyone ever complained about, leading them to ask:
"What’s the most ridiculous 'first world problem' you’ve seen people get worked up over?"
"Tale As Old As Time..."
"I once knew a mom who was legitimately devastated, to the point of tears/grief, because a doctor predicted her 8 year old daughter's final height to be around 5'2","
"Which wasn't tall enough to get cast as Belle at Disney World."
"That was the child's (and her mother's) only dream in life, apparently."
"Didn't appreciate my suggestion that she could be Minnie or Mickey."
"Lol!"
"Only a face character would do!"- TravelLovingMom
"Must Be Funny, In A Rich Man's World..."
"My boss from about a decade ago was this insanely rich dude who always went to the bank to get fresh and crisp currency."
"He'd call the bank in advance to make sure they had some on hand."
"I think he was a germaphobe."
"He had a trash can that he'd throw $1 and $5 bills in that he thought was 'dirty' and regularly just donated it vs spending it."
"I asked him why he did this and he said it was too much trouble and asked if I wanted it."
"I said f*ck yeah dumped it into my bag and when I got home it was close to $400 in singles and fives.
"Another time, he wanted to upgrade all the computers in his studio, so we went to a store and bought 10 PCs."
"They all had $150 mail in rebates and he wasn't bothered to go through the trouble of mailing them in."
"3 weeks later I received $1500 after spending a whole afternoon filling out all those goddamn forms."- azninvasion2000
Money Burn GIF by nog
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Who Wore It Better?
"When I was about 19 years old, I was at my boyfriends family BBQ."
"I was wearing this pretty floral sundress."
"His cousins girlfriend showed up in the same dress and she was SO mad that she went and changed."
"I will never understand being upset when someone is wearing the same thing as you.'
"Did you really think that your shirt you bought off the rack is going to be unique to you?"
"No."- mertsey627
Seeing Red! Or Blue In This Case...
"The blue of the balloons wasn't quite the same as the bridesmaid's sashes."
"Years ago my wife and I attended a wedding."
"It was very low key."
"The dinner was in the dining hall at the university where the couple met, cinder block walls and all."
"It was a Baptist wedding - no booze and very serious."
"The dark blue balloons attempting to liven up the hall were a slightly darker shade of blue than the sashes on the bridesmaid's dresses."
"The bride lost here sh*t and absolutely raved for nearly an hour."
"I can't remember how they finally managed to talk her down."- mechant_papa
south park wedding GIF
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See You In Court!
"Rich neighbors who end up in expensive court battles because they disagree about where a tree can be planted or whether the color of a fence fits in with the street’s 'amenity'."
'These disputes get really heated and rack up huge lawyers’ bills."
"The most pathetic part is after the judgement when they are arguing about who should pay the other party’s costs."
"Lots of affidavits filed citing the 'emotional distress' they had to endure, or painting themselves as brave warriors who were forced to take a stand to fight for 'justice'."
"Also lots of pompous litigants insisting that the judge refer to them by their 'Dr' title."
"An absolutely insane dumpster fire of entitled rich people problems."- ElectrocRaisin
It's Always People With Money Who Don't Want To Pay!
"I work in a public library."
"People will get so so mad if they have to be put on a wait list for a book."
"A popular book that just came out."
"Ok our services are not only free but so are the books."
"You’re welcome, a**holes."- Switchbladekitten
A Warm Butt Is A Happy Butt!
"My own."
"We have a bidet toilet seat (Fabulous! Everyone should have one!) and not only does it wash your bum and blow dry it, but the seat's heated!"
"It's shocking how much a heated toilet seat makes the whole process more agreeable."
"Except: We had a power outage and I went to use the toilet and the seat was cold!"
"Unacceptable!"
"This shall not stand!"
"I was really upset because it didn't feel good."
"Then I stopped and thought: This is the most first-world problem anyone's ever had."
"I was really pissed because my heiny was tepid."
"I got over it."- DeathGrover
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Holy Matrimony!
"Weddings are a gold mine for this question."
"People get so hyped up over their 'most important day of their life'."
"They'll destroy friendships, go into debt, and have crazy expectations."
"It's not always the couple who go crazy, either."
"Sometimes, it's the parents or another family member who feels entitled to control the wedding."
"It's just a party."
"Be considerate of guests, have plenty of food and drinks, and enjoy it."- magicrowantree
When Fast Food Isn't Fast Enough...
"Having to pull off to the side to wait for a drive-thru order to be brought out to you because your food isn't ready and there's a line building up behind you."- demanbmore
In Case You Don't Think Customer Service Employees Are Undervalued...
"I was working the return desk at a Target next to a military base so I have so many stories."
"One of my favorites was a lady who had her baby shower before revealing the gender and was livid that she had received floral newborn diapers when she’s having a boy."
"It was a huge box of super expensive, all organic diapers, that we didn’t carry and therefore could not return."
"I cannot accurately express her fury and disgust."
"How dare either suggest her boy could wear feminine diapers."
"I suggested she donate them if she didn’t want to use them and she instead threw away the entire box."
"When she left we pulled it out and threw it in our donate bin."
"There have also been multiple times where mom’s order massive toys and when we bring them out to the car they get furious that they aren’t wrapped."
"We don’t offer wrapping services."
"Here’s the thing, if you don’t want your kids to see the toys you got them for Christmas or their bit to day DON'T BRING THE CHILD WHEN YOU PICK IT UP."
'I’ve had multiple women scream and curse me out that I had ruined their kids Christmas by bringing the toys they ordered out to the car like they requested."- clever-mermaid-mae
Customer Service Waiting GIF by Juno Calypso
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Happiest Place On Earth!
"I used to work for Disney."
"That in itself should tell you everything."
"However for fun I'll give you two specific stories one form our tech department and one from my wife who worked bookings."
"I specifically worked for their call center to help with technical issues with magic band and the website."
"Suddenly got worse huh?"
"A right of passage call everyone has at least one story of is the 'Dome call'."
"Basically there is a subset of Disney Guest (TM) that believes if it rains at Walt Disney world there is someone that will push a button to encapsulate the whole of Disney property in a dome to keep out the rain."
"I'm not kidding."
"If this button is not pushed they call our tech department to angrily ask why."
"My wife worked booking."
"Pretty much everything including Bibbidi Bobbidi boutique and Pirate's league."
"These two things did roughly the same thing difference being price and theme."
"BBB was expensive did more and was focused on princesses, pirates league did a bit less and focused on mermaids and pirates."
"Lady called up my wife, and got pissed about BBB being booked up (It goes FAAAAST)."
"Karen: 'Im going to give the phone to my daughter and I want you to tell her how you are ruining her vacation by not letting her do BBB'."
"Wife proceeds to explain how pirate's league is so much cooler and how she can be a mermaid or pirate and basically gets the kid to start demanding to their parents about how they want to be a mermaid instead of a princess."- trollsong
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The horror!
Being booked into a junior suite at Disney World instead of an executive suite!
It's almost as bad as having no money for groceries, or no food to feed you children...
Said absolutely no one.