Parents With Estranged Adult Children Explain What Went Wrong
Reddit user bridge2235 asked: 'People who have adult children that don’t talk to you. Why do you think that is?'
*The following article contains discussion of suicide/self-harm.
There are a lot of old platitudes about familial bonds, mostly focused on preserving the relationship with relatives—especially immediate family—no matter what.
But public attitudes have shifted in part due to greater awareness of the harm caused by unhealthy relationships.
Now people discuss relationships with terms like gaslighting, toxic, emotional blackmail and going no/low contact.
The once taboo act of cutting family members out of your life has gained greater acceptance.
But what do the family members—especially parents—excised feel?
Reddit user bridge2235 asked:
"People who have adult children that don’t talk to you. Why do you think that is?"
Personal Issues
"I was very deep in resolving my own trauma when my kids were growing up. I was often distant and emotionally unavailable."
"I wasn’t the parent they deserved. It is the greatest sorrow of my life; I did to my kids what my mom did to me."
"I can’t be sorry enough."
~ Interesting-Ant-5163
New Family
"From the other parent's perspective, my adult children (25 and 23) do not communicate with their father at all."
"Long story short, he remarried about a week after our divorce was final and he and his new wife went on to have children of their own. Over time, his visits with the children because more infrequent and stressful due to his wife's distaste for me and my children."
"He has had no contact with the kids in over 3 years and his previous attempt was 4 years before that."
"My youngest says he will never forgive his father for replacing us all with a new family and forgetting us. The oldest says it's just not worth chasing someone who has no interest."
"Personally, I'm sad and angry on their behalf. He divorced me, not them."
"I want to say, the amount of people who say they've experienced this same issue astounds me, and breaks my heart."
"I just do not understand a parent who can walk away from their child(ren). Even when it's been hard and I've had to be both Mom and Dad, I wouldn't trade my kids for anything."
~ geminiloveca
Substance Abuse
"Mom here. My 23-year-old hasn't spoken to me in four years. It was completely my fault."
"I've struggled with addiction (alcohol) and for most of her childhood I was bad. I hope to be able to apologize to her someday."
"But, I completely understand and respect her decision."
~ Prudent_Blueberry_23
"My step daughter is an addict and mentally ill. Her son was placed in our custody by the state three years ago at 13 months old and she has never made the effort to regain custody."
"Her rights were terminated last year and we adopted him last month when the state gave us the choice."
"She has hated us ever since he was placed here and has convinced herself that we stole her child."
"She only contacted my husband if she wanted money, which he won't give her so that makes her hate us more."
~ True_Let_8993
"My daughter went through a traumatic event when she found out her Mom was having an affair with a junkie. Daughter was furious at her Mom for destroying the family."
"Mom flipped out, threatened [to hurt herself] to our daughter’s face, blaming her. At that moment, everything shifted and daughter became the nurturer to her Mom, who regressed into childhood—a complete switching of roles when my daughter really needed a Mom.
"Mom wasn’t safe to be angry at (for fear she’d hurt herself), so I became the target."
"We talk, but it’s so terse and superficial that it’s close to non-communication. I’d like to talk through what happened, even in a therapeutic setting, but daughter says that’s off the table."
~ Utterlybored
"It’s very common for the kids to seek affection more from the abusive parent, who does not give it freely. It’s also common for the non-abusive parent to get all the deflected emotions that the abusive parent has trained the children not to point their way."
~ AbsentGlare
"The safe person always becomes the punching bag. Happens in any kind of relationship."
~ TeutonJon78
Narcissists
"There's a woman at church and every week she asks for prayers during prayer requests. At first I thought it was kinda cute but it's over a year later and she always asks for prayers that her children will speak with her again."
"She claims to have been the best mother and, one-by-one, all three of her adult children and thus her grandchildren stopped speaking with her. But she did everything right—she fed them, she clothed them, she put them through school.
"Which to me sounds like the bare minimum that you're supposed to do as a parent and not 'everything', but OK."
"I gave her the benefit of the doubt but then, every week, another piece of the puzzle would come out."
"She tried calling but her numbers blocked. She tried to find them on social media but she's blocked."
"How strange—she says she was such an excellent mother, why would they block her?"
"She tried reaching out again and received a handwritten letter on why she should never contact them again, but we never heard the contents of the letter."
"We were just supposed to pity her and have sympathy and assume that these entire separate groups of people were evil and were doing her emotional harm."
"I got to know her and she is an abusive narcissist and nothing short of pure evil. All the red flags you'd expect are there. But, every week it's pray to Jesus for me everybody, my evil ungrateful children, blah, blah, blah."
"I'd like to hope she is just clueless but I understand she is sick and probably doesn't know how horrible she really is. I feel very, very bad for her kids but very happy they were strong enough to break away from that hot mess."
"It almost brings me physical pain now when she asks for prayers that her kids will talk to her again, because I know all she wants to do is resume hurting them."
~ OregonHighSpores
"Probably my mom. Tell Susan I said 'Hi'."
"Or don’t actually. You should probably go no contact also before she wrecks your life, too. "
~ caseofthef'karounds
"I’m lucky. Both my adult children call me multiple times a week. But my ex (their father) complains that our daughter rarely calls him."
"I’ve told him many, many times that if he wanted her to call more often he needs to listen to her."
"He’s a pretty narcissistic dude who only wants to talk and if he takes a breath and you try to jump into the conversation, he either gets louder to drown you out or he goes dead silent, clearly in his 'waiting until you shut up so I can talk' mode."
"He never asks questions or expresses any interest in their lives."
"My son puts up with it because he can direct some of the conversation by bringing up sports or interesting historical stuff or books or whatever and then they can have somewhat of a discourse (although listening to the inevitable droning lecture is always included)."
"My daughter has little patience for that so she rarely calls him. Even after I told him what he should try, he ignores me, which is what he did for nearly the entirety of our marriage."
"He still periodically bemoans the fact that she doesn’t call."
~ Big-Summer-
"My mother told me, three weeks after I lost my father/best friend at fourteen, that he told her on his deathbed that 'Adopting me was his greatest mistake'."
"It stuck with me my whole life. I'm 38, and now know it wasn't true. But that narcissistic b*tch can rot in Hell."
~ Willing-Survey7448
"I think my Uncle would say it's because his sons were brainwashed by their wives."
"The truth is, I think my cousins didn't see that my Uncle's (diagnosed) narcissism wasn't normal, because they were raised by him."
"Their wives, as outsiders, pointed this out to them for the first time and they made their decision from there."
~ jademenagerie
Unavailable
"[I'm the] parent. It’s because I f'ked up and neglected the relationship."
"I wasn’t the father she deserved. It’s that simple."
"I came from an abusive, chaotic household. My father never once said he loved me. I said I would be different. Although I love her, my actions did not reflect it.
"Throughout her childhood, I can remember so many times that I had the chance to demonstrate my feelings. I had the chance to make moments into impactful teaching moments and core memories for her."
"Looking back, it’s not that I missed those chances. I NEVER TOOK THE SHOT. You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take. I have told myself that I have failed at many things in life, but that I am not a failure."
"I can’t lie to myself here. As a father, I failed. It hurts, but I know it’s nothing compared to the hurt and damage I’ve caused to her. I put her on what could be a long road, an uphill battle to learn to love herself."
"I hope she’s stronger than I was and never feels that she wasn’t good enough for me to love her. I wasn’t good enough of a man to be her father. I didn’t deserve her."
"She really was a good kid despite the pain I know she lived with. I can’t tell her I’m sorry. She’s an adult now and has gone no contact."
"I lost her. This is the one true failure I will have to live with. And die with."
~ UltraBunnyBoostST
"I'm going to pretend my Dad wrote this and accept that him ignoring me, my daughter, my husband, and our life we've made, is really that simple."
"He neglected the relationship. He's not the father I deserve."
~ weberster
"You don't need to hear him say it to know it's true. If your dad wasn't there for you and wasn't the father you deserve, that's on him."
"It hurts you too, but it's not your fault and had nothing to do with you."
~ fuqqkevindurant
Untreated Disorders
"My children are low contact. I feel it's fair. Their mother has Bi-Polar Disorder."
"She was violent and abusive. She has gotten help since then but she still hurt them in the past."
"I did not protect them. Them not being around me is justified. They should be angry."
"We f'ked up. They didn't do anything wrong and they need to heal as they see fit."
"Kids not being around their parents have valid reasons. Most people just can't accept it."
~ AcademicPin8777
"I had PTSD and didn't deal with it. In short I was a sh*tty dad."
~ legl0ckholmes
"Not sure how many people understand PTSD, even those of us that have it. You look normal, no one can really tell you are emotionally/mentally screwed up."
"It's very unpredictable and unpredictable can be rough on kids. I yelled too much and have worked hard to stop."
"Hope you aren't in a blame cycle and have forgiveness for yourself. It's hard."
~ Desslock73
"I am a parent of a child—daughter—who does still talk to me but rarely and I fully accept that it is my fault."
"I was an immature parent and made some bad decisions in addition to being inconsistent with my parenting due to immaturity."
"I am also on the spectrum but that’s something I didn’t find out until a few years ago when my son was diagnosed."
"I know I wasn’t great and I understand my daughter and I try to give her space."
~ RTrinitoneBlast
Religion
"A cousin’s parents fired him from their very successful family business because he refused to take his wife and children to their church and worship the way they did. In retaliation he and his wife refused to allow his parents to see the grandchildren."
"They sued. They lost. They never were able to see their grandchildren and eventually died."
"He ended up with the business anyway by default, not by the will. They lost decades of grandchildren just by being stubborn."
"Nobody in the family had anything to do with them the last 35 years of their lives and they were miserable."
"Parents, if you f'k over your children don't expect to every have your grandchildren."
~ HixsonHank
"Child here and I just want to say, huge props to the parents taking accountability."
"I wonder if mine will ever do the same."
~ SKmaric
Redditor Fivepurplehoodies provided sound advice for parents.
"Just love and respect your kids. Do your best."
"Admit that you sometimes miss the mark, even if you had the best intentions."
"Don’t invalidate your kids’ experiences."
"That’s it. That’s all."
That's good advice for all family relationships.
****
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988 by phone or text or via chat on their website: https://988lifeline.org/
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://www.iasp.info/resources/Crisis_Centres/
All of us have something that we tend to "geek out" over.
This could be a book, television show, actor, singer or sports team.
But some shows or celebrities have a considerably wider fanbase than others, as evidenced by the terms "Trekkies" or "Beliebers".
Some times, members of these fan bases are so passionate, that they often come off as obnoxious or aggressive, possibly even hurting the reputation of the people or product they go wild over.
Redditor vejack was curious to learn which fan bases the Reddit community tends to find the most off putting, leading them to ask:
"Which is the most toxic community/fan base that you know?"
Everyone has an opinion...
"Reddit."- tall2022420
"Reddit and Quora."
"Haha."- emriverawriter
Oof, that's bad...
"It's not a big community, but there are items in the dilapidated bowels of the Chernobyl nuclear plant that are less toxic than the Super Smash Brothers Melee fan base."- CorgisDie
When the creators tell you to back off, take a hint!
"'Rick and Morty'."
"Even the show's creators have had to clash with them and their toxicity."- JeremyZenith·
Rick And Morty Facepalm GIFGiphyI like it, in small doeses...
"Kpop fans."
"I love really enjoy Kpop and am a fan myself, but damn. I sometimes just can't."- Ok-Enthusiasm-6975
"Kpop."- Impressive_Dot_7631
Love the animation, the fans, not so much...
"Some anime community’s."- thomas_da_tra1n
It's just a TV show... tone it down a bit...
"I expected to find this but haven't yet."
"The Supernatural Fandom."
"Other than the whole populous of it are cringe and over the top, getting tattoos of a show detail etc."
"They've literally bullied the show to continue the show past the natural ending, season 5, and for literally half a decade made them try to poop out content that topped the last season, with no where to really go to at that point."
"The consistent push on 'shipping' characters together that make the actors visably uncomfortable."
"The fan base is full of edgy people who gatekeep everything.'- develyn507
All of them!!!
"Are there any non toxic fan bases anymore?"
"The whole idea of people getting together and arguing with anyone that disagrees with them just breeds discontent."- KingGuy420
Stop It Neil Patrick Harris GIFGiphyAt least they get them excited about reading...
"YA writers."
"No specific authors, but the community of them."- D-Rez
Play Nice!
"Roblox."- YoussefAhmedSaied
Best in Small Doses
"SML Wiki and other SML Related stuff. including SML channel itself in the Community Tab."- Owl-Fighter2601
scooter sml GIFGiphyThe force is not strong with everyone.
"Star Wars."- SilasUnmuth80
"'Star Wars' community, mainly the adults, they have a habit of complaining like children and harassing the actors/actresses for their rolls."- Unstoppable-dirtball
YouTube reaches a wide audience...
"Dream the mincraft guy."- me_playz
When does it stop being "art"?
"In my opinion the grappling martial arts community."
"Jujitsu, wrestling etc."
"I'm saying this because a some pure grapplers find striking martial arts a 'waste of time' and some even say that ground and pound is somehow a good striking martial art substitute."- PerfectWin912
keeping up with the kardashians karate GIFGiphyMaybe time to unplug?
"Fortnite."- Mordesi-Kai_Roth
​​At least when you inflict it on others
"Christianity."- Antipotheosis
Whatever happened to good sportsmanship?
"Cleveland Browns fans."
"Literally ran the only QB to win them a playoff game this century out of town."- sometimeswelaugh
There's nothing wrong with being passionate about something we love.
But when that passion starts to become competitive, even unsafe, can you even still call it a fanbase "community"?
Humanity is coming to a close.
Okay, that is a tad dramatic.
But we are in peril. We're fighting and engaging in violence.
But we can change course. We just have to acknowledge the threats.
Redditor invertedparadX wanted to warn people about all the things toxic to the human existence.
They asked:
"What do you believe is the greatest threat to humanity?"
I just have little faith in any of us.
So I can't help in the saving.
So help me understand...
So Dumb
"Lack of critical thinking. The rise of social media and political theatre is making society dumber and dumber." ~ bchamper
Giphyresistance...
"Bacterial resistance to antibiotics." ~ zygomelonm
"There are a couple of very important things the public can do. Take your entire course of antibiotics and don't quit when you feel better. Don't take a couple of random old antibiotics you have around the house when you get sick."
"Don't drag your kid to the doctor and insist they are given unneeded antibiotics. Doctors: don't overprescribe them." ~ StrLord_Who
Ad Abuse
"Greed/selfishness. It seems to motivate 99% of the problems we see in society." ~ Background-Company30
"Yeah and ads in general on YouTube. Google put ads in damn near every corner of YouTube; in videos, banner ads (both large ones on the website and in videos) videos that are ads themselves etc. They are abusing ads at this point." ~ Sea_Perspective6891
"I got 4, FOUR ads in a row yesterday. I couldn't skip the first two and was too busy to check if the other 2 could he skipped but it's just excessive. I spent more time on the ads than I did on the video itself." ~ CT-96
Hand to Mouth
"Pringles. One pop and you can not stop." ~ IT_Account
"ManagerI can't fit my hand inside a Pringle can. I have a huge amount of trouble fitting my hand inside of a Pringle can."
"I can get my hand like four inches into the can but then I have to tilt the can into my mouth but by that point a bunch of crumbs have accumulated at the bottom of the can so they all go spilling on my face." ~ Dodecahedonism_
Sounds about right so far.
Why are we so dumb?
Future of the Damned
"Ignorance, and more recently, the enshrining of ignorance as a valid and even popular state of being. We are damning our futures by allowing the lowest intellects and least self-aware to dictate what books are too crass, or what subjects too taboo." ~ ItsTtreasonThen
GiphyStupid...
"Our own stupidity and arrogance." ~ fotofiend
"Beat me to it! These were also BOTH my first thoughts! I believe, when these two are combined, this is known as Cognitive Dissonance?"
"Is that correct? When people are too prideful and arrogant to recognize/accept how ignorant they actually are." ~ Lutefiskaficionado
"You might be thinking of the Dunning Kruger effect. It has more to do with being too dumb to realize how ignorant you are, but there's usually at least a dash of arrogance in the mix as well." ~ CashOrReddit
"The Corporation"
"Greed/selfishness. It seems to motivate 99% of the problems we see in society." ~ jdoe10202021
"Actually, greed is mandatory and legally enforced, a CEO can get fired, and sued, for making any decision clearly counter to maximizing profit for company shareholders."
"There is a great documentary called 'The Corporation' that has some incredibly eye opening stories about this." ~ RookXPY
Drink Up
"Drinkable water shortage." ~ JollySpaceCowboy
"We are literally letting fresh water melt into the Ocean. If Money wasn't a problem we would be harvesting the melting ice caps already since it's all just fresh water." ~ Upper_Decision_5959
"Simply not true, we will never run out of drinkable water." ~ thrwhwhwh
Needs and Wants
"Consumer culture. Needless consumption destroys the environment. Collectively we need to take a more measured approach to this based on needs, not wants." ~ Scallywagstv2
GiphyWe can do better.
We have to.
But do we want to?
We'll find out.
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Sign up for the Knowable newsletter here.
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People Share Red Flags To Look For During A Job Interview That Scream 'Toxic Workplace'
Interviewing for a new job is just as much time for the employer to see if you're a good fit as it is for you. There are a few things that you might want to ask about to get a good idea of the workplace culture.
The answers to those questions are going to paint you a good picture of what it's like to work there. And sometimes that picture is not pretty.
Toxic work environments are not worth the headache, even if it's a good paying job. We made a list of some of the red flags to look out for in the job interview.
Redditor RexJgeh asked:
"What are some red flags during job interviews that scream 'toxic workplace?'"
Take notes!
They didn't have an answer.
"I asked the manager, "What are you most proud of when it comes to your staff?'"
"They couldn't think of anything."
"One time I asked an interviewer what their favorite part of working there was and her response was, 'Umm….. Umm…. Honestly, I'm not sure let me think.'"
"Literally it took her 30 seconds to come up with anything and her only response was, 'We start really early in the morning so it's great to get off work at 2:00.'"
"Lmao BYE!!!"
"I'm going to try to remember this, and use it next time it seems fitting. I enjoy asking bosses questions that don't beat around the bush, like 'What am I doing wrong and how can I improve?' when they come to my work area complaining about stuff. They have NEVER EVER had an answer yet."
"I took a job that seemed very promising. The first month was gold. We were making progress, adding to the team, etc. by month three, things all but shifted. The owner was lying to clients, work was entirely disorganized and their moods went from optimistic to scared."
"At my 90 day review, which was actually my 110 day review, the boss asked me what I was proud of. And because of the tension of the last week and my decision to leave because of the chaos, I literally said 'I appreciate my ability to stay tall in a windstorm. But aside from that, nothing.' We ended the meeting and I decided to put in my notice, but I figured I'd give it more thought, so I decided not to be impulsive."
"For whatever reason I decided to give it another week. And the boss gives me a call and cowardly laid me off and gave me a 12k severance. Glad I didn't quit."
Time is everything.
"The shorter the interview, the more desperate the company is to just hire someone."
"Bonus points if the person currently in the position you're interviewing for has worked there for less than a year."
"Literally had a single 30-minute interview (that I thought was an initial) for a major position (that wasn't even the original position I applied for) and was offered the job about an hour later."
"…run away"
"Only if they offer you the job. If you have a short interview and dont get an offer, it means you bombed the first couple of questions and they had more to do with their time."
"Source: recently went through dozens of interviews with unqualified candidates and after one where the guy had no relevant experience and couldn't answer basic questions like 'in a project, do you identify yourself as a leader, work horse, or other?'"
"We had to have a serious talk with the recruitment team about the folks they were greenlighting for interviews."
Unnecessary overtime.
"I was trying to find a better advertising job and during an interview I asked about how much overtime I could expect."
"Owner of the company goes, 'Well, you know, we try to get home on time, we do try. But, hey, this is the life we chose.'"
"Dude, you make billboards for restaurants...you're not saving lives here. The most frustrating part about working in advertising is that so many of the late nights could be avoided with slightly better management and less over-promising to the client. Glad I'm out of it, now."
- SeaTie
"This is something I had to emphasize to a manager. My office was hit hard by COVID, and I happily put in the overtime, and still do when we get hit by surges of COVID work, because delays can literally mean death."
"But before COVID, we were a 40 hour a week office with very rare overtime. COVID seemed to transform the expectations that we'd just stay on our extended schedules forever, and would take in that much more routine work to replace COVID work."
"But I don't want 30 extra hours of routine overtime work. No one dies because we aren't doing that work. I could make 3 times as much elsewhere with the expectation that I work 80 hours a week. I intentionally chose the lower-paid, 40-hour job."
- Fadnn6
"The last place I worked at the Marketing staff had a saying 'the struggle is real.' The Marketing manager wasn't allowed to talk to the Technology department UI developer because the developer thought the manager was way too mean."
"Advertising is one of the most fucked up, toxic industries I've ever worked in. No client, agency trust. Many many agencies' only competitive edge is to underprice their work. Work their employees to death without batting an eye. Don't distribute their revenue streams so they lose a client and there goes 40% of their billing and subsequently their staff. Employees constantly throwing each other under the bus. And employees are grossly underpaid."
"Definitely don't miss going into work and seeing 1/3 of the company gone one day and wondering if I'm next."
- bensonnd
Parents Explain Which Things Surprised Them Most When Their Child Moved Out | George Takei’s Oh Myyy
Look for the subtext.
"'Fast-paced, dynamic environment' can be code for 'look, we don't have our sh*t together.'"
"'Expect to be putting out a ton of fires.'"
"'We all wear several hats here!' = You'll work 5 different jobs and get paid for 1."
"'You'll wear many hats,'" means they're going to make you do what should be the jobs of several different people."
"Got told once for my first job's orientation: 'No one here is above cleaning toilets! We all help each other out,' …. Actually, I didn't go to school to clean sh*t off of the company toilets sorry."
"This one makes me mad. When I was first hired to fix the organization I'm currently at, the department head would not place our buildings on the janitorial rotation. It wasn't because there was no funding for it or anything, oh no, it was because that was what the night shift was for. I couldn't believe how insulting he was and that he felt it was perfectly acceptable to make employees clean toilets that every staff member used. We have janitorial services now, but dang that made me angry back then."
Work and play.
"'We work hard and play hard here.'"
"Also known as, 'There's a lot of overtime, but we put up a Ping-Pong table to make up for that. Also we have weekly social events that we legally can't force you to attend, but that you really should attend.'"
- Rannasha
"Also, the Ping-Pong table isn't in a separated space so in case someone does play, the people who are trying to focus on their work will look like d*ckheads if they try to speak up about the noise! It's a cool new way to create unnecessary strife between coworkers!"
The desperation.
"No interview, just, 'Can you start tomorrow?'"
"Lol the only time I've heard this was when I was applying to summer jobs in high school and one place I applied to was Vector marketing (a pyramid scheme company). Luckily, someone told me it was a pyramid scheme before I actually started 'working' there."
"When I was young, I had an interview at a car wash."
"It wasn't 'start tomorrow,' it was 'start right now.'"
- Thneed1
"I was kind of put off when my current job was pretty much that, but I kinda knew why. COVID gave them a lot more work than they had employees for, I was recommended by someone we both knew, and they guy I was replacing was only leaving after 6 years to start his dream career."
Still very off putting when I didn't send in a resume... I don't even think I told them what I was doing for work at the time."
"But they treat me well and were completely prepared if I came in with absolutely 0 knowledge of the field. Almost 2 months in and it's great. I guess it varies from job to job."
A few Redditors mentioned there are some jobs that just don't need an extensive interview process.
"Literally any job in food service lmao."
"That led to one if my best jobs. Not even 'can you start tomorrow?' But 'can you start right now?'"
"The job was with a catering company, washing dishes for cirque de soleil. The dude paid me 15$/hr to wash dishes (this was like 10 years ago to). When I got a gig playing a show 4 nights a week he was cool with it and told me to chase my dreams and let me work the other shifts, hiring a pt guy to cover my lost shifts."
"Everyone there was super friendly and we had a lot of laughs."
If the first person you see isn't having a good time...
"Irritable and/or nasty receptionist."
"Just don't even bother trying to navigate the minefield of a place where even the person who is paid to smile can't quite manage it. Life is too short."
"I used to be able to avoid applying places where people didn't seem happy. Not a thing anymore. And you can barely trust Glassdoor."
"Lmao I looked up a company I was applying to once and saw a Glassdoor review from someone who gave it 5 stars and really talked it up. I googled their name and they were the f*cking CEO pretending to be someone in a lower position. Red flags for me."
"They have a high turnover rate."
"It is very easily one of the questions you ask the interviewer, 'How many people have joined the company in the last two years?' If the answer is a lot, but don't have growth of the company to show for it, that means it's just people quitting that they need to backfill. I've also asked 'What is the average tenure of people in your group?' to get a sense for how long people have been willing to work for this manager."
"Turns out the opposite can be a problem as well. At my current job, the vast majority of my coworkers have been there 20-30 years. Not a great environment."
- ka36
Co-workers are not family.
"'We're a family here.'"
"Fell for that once. Never again. It was family until people got greedy and backstabbed each other. It's also where I came up with the 'drowning cat' analogy. If a cat is in water, it will claw the absolute sh*t out of anything it can to get out of the water. Get enough of them together and they will shred each other to pieces and still get nowhere (no, I would never do this, it's an analogy...)."
"Dude, my family is abusive. When they say this, I cringe."
"The family one is a huge red flag for me. I worked at a place that always talked about the team members being like a family. It meant you felt horrible about calling in sick, they'd guilt you into working over time because of the culture, and when you finally put in your leave or told them you where leaving you where treated like nothing. Bosses use the family thing to guilt you into being a slave!! My boss even tried to guilt us into coming in on the weekend and working for free!!!"
"Crab bucket mentality it's called."
"Crabs will pull other crabs down if they try to escape a bucket rather than climb out themselves."
- Tkieron
A current employee gave a tip.
"An employee looks up at you and slowly shakes their head while you are on a tour with management..."
"This happened while I interviewed at a competitor to my former employer. They were trying to poach me, and I was sick of my previous employer, so I went in and talked. They talked a good game and nearly had me convinced to join. We went through on a final tour and one of the employees made a subtle "stay away if you know what's good for you" gesture towards me while I was walking by."
"That guy saved me a lot of heartache because 6 months later the company lost a major contract, laid off 25% of the team and cut everyone else's pay by 25%+. I only know because one of my former colleagues went there and it hurt him financially."
"What a legend."
Just creepy vibes.
"I interviewed for an administrative management position with a smaller magazine publisher. There were rumors about the owner of the publication (not an easy person to work for)."
"I sit with an interview panel first for thirty minutes - Shipping Manager, Accountant, Legal, Layout Editor. Each of them introduces themselves in a very clipped manner. Each asked one question, read from a piece of paper. As I answered the question, no one took notes, no one asked any backup questions."
"Then I met with the CFO. The receptionist had to go back to her desk to get the office keys because the CFO's office door was locked. It was always locked. Meet with the CFO, and he asks the exact same four questions the panelists asked. He, too - no notes, no follow up questions."
"The I met with the owner. His office looked like it was meant to be a training room. Huge amounts of space, and lots of dead-animal themes art-ing up the place. I sat with the owner for about an hour. It seemed a pretty reasonable discussion. Then the final couple of questions."
"Him: 'You've met most of my primary managers. What do you think?'"
"Me: 'To be honest, they all seemed disinterested in the interview.'"
"Him: 'I know they are. I'll make the decision on who to hire. I just want them to have a favorite.'"
"*DING DING DING DING*"
"Effing creeepy vibes. Lock-down environment. Managers dealing with a psycho boss. And the money person's office always locked? Nope."
- Yabloski
Employers who are desperate will say anything to make you work for them. It's important to keep your eyes and ears open for red flag that clue you in on what's really going on.
Toxic fan behavior has been a staple of American celebrity culture. That's what brought the famous British band The Beatles over to the States. They knew their career would take off, and it did, and even had women fainting in their concerts.
Since then, celebrities have been idolized to a point where fans feel connected to celebrities on a deeply emotional level. In reality, that star has no idea who that fan even is, let alone feelings any emotional connection.
This is what we call "Stan Behavior," which stems from an Eminem song called Stan. Ultimately, the term has evolved even further since the internet makes us connected to what our favorite celebrities are up to at almost all times.
Fans on the internet can become vicious when doting after their popular celebrity crushes. If someone comes after their pop culture icon on Twitter, they become a mob trying to defend them. As if celebrities can do no wrong (we know that's not true, they're human just like us).
Redditors shared some of the most toxic fan bases out there today.
Redditor asked:
"What's the most toxic fan base you've ever seen?"
Here's some of those toxic fans, and sometimes equally as toxic celebrities.
Defending abusers.
"Chris Brown, seconds after he almost beat Rihanna to death, they were bending over backward to rationalize the assault, mercilessly attacking anyone who spoke up about it, and haven't stopped for over a decade. And they won, he's still famous, successful, and a huge participant in popular culture."
"If it makes you feel better, he is banned from entering Australia, New Zealand, and the United Kingdom, due to his criminal record."
"The most wtf moment was I was talking about music to a girl from work and she said she loved Chris brown. I explained why I didn't like him and the whole beating up Rihanna, her response to it was, 'Yeah, but he's hot.'"
"That kinda stopped me for a second."
"Similar conversation I had with girls I worked with. One was playing music and was asking who liked Chris Brown and I was the only one who said I didn't. They were all shocked when I said uh because he's a woman abuser so he's a terrible person. And they all started saying ohhhh well maybe that's just how the relationship was. These girls were all 19 and 20. I was stunned."
"This just made me sad. Imagine believing that kind of relationship is 'normal' enough."
Killer fans.
"All those crazy fans who support serial killers just because they think they're hot. Ted Bundy fanatics, etc."
"When the Boston Marathon bombing happened some women were fawning over the Tsarnaev kid. Rolling Stone published a mugshot that looked more like a boy band pic with ruffled hair and all that. Kinda tasteless after he helped kill 4 people and blasted ball bearings through dozens more."
"There are plenty of hot people who aren't crazy, why do people idolize the crazy ones."
"Crazy a** BTS stans threatened to kill me when I said their Korean songs are better than their English ones."
"Stan culture in general, tbh, is toxic af. It just involves supporting strangers blindly, no matter what they do. Just switching off all critical thinking. I feel like this obsessive fan behaviour is exactly what Eminem was condemning in that song, but now it's a good thing?"
"But yeah, K-pop stans are a different breed. I like K-pop but I never say I'm a fan because I look at other people who say they're fans and I go... Nah I don't like anything that much lol."
"There's no way anyone who calls themselves a Stan has heard the song it originally came from lol."
The fans that love to hate.
"No one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans."
"Star Wars fans and Star Wars fans are natural enemies."
"I work in the TV industry. I've been involved in all sorts of things from Doctor Who to Marvel and DC movies. Star Wars is the only production I can mention where I physically get harassed for."
"Dude, I was a background extra on it for 6 months. Do you REALLY think I have any say in the script?"
"I was a background extra on it for 6 months."
"Oh come on Ahmed Best, now you're selling yourself short!"
The reputation follows the fans that aren't toxic.
"I'm surprised that nobody has mentioned Rick and Morty yet."
"I believe it USED to be a toxic fandom, but when the lightning in a bottle died out it seems that only the people who are super interested in the show are still watching it. It's still a great show nonetheless."
"I am a big fan of the show, but the fans have such a toxic reputation that I don't wear any merch because of the negative associations."
If you want to read more about the toxic Rick and Morty fan base, here's a Medium article that breaks it down.
"I did enjoy the pickle Rick episode where Dr. Wong (voiced by Susan Surandon), calls out Rick and to an extent, the diehard fans, that being intelligent (or perceived intelligence) is not a justification to be a sh*tty person."
"Here's the scene if you want to see it."
- Apod1991
"It's funny too because that episode is probably what launched the fandom to its highest heights of toxicity."
The reboot that caused a violent fan base.
"The Voltron Fandom. The show itself took a nosedive after a couple good seasons, but the fanbase got wild. Massive shipping wars that had people run off the internet and calling each other pedophiles; blackmailing the studio; harassing VAs; someone reportedly sent cupcakes with glass in them or something."
- yrk-h8r
"I'd second this. The Voltron fandom also built up a quagmire that spread to other fandoms even long after the original show has lost any relevance. It's genuinely not uncommon to find toxic people in newer fandoms these days and find that they were Voltron fans at one point. Or that they proudly had a hand in also shaping the media landscape for that product to be as awful as it was."
"While there have been many shows with fandoms that allowed toxic mindsets to fester I genuinely feel like the effects of that particular fandom had a knock on effect for all that followed it."
Just taking this video game too an extreme.
"As much as I love Five Nights at Freddy's, I came across a good fair share of fans who would fight over which gender the spirits of the animatronics were, some who firmly believed in one of MatPat's theories, and, hell, even some people who literally went yandere over some of the characters, saying that characters like Bonnie or Freddy belonged to them and only to them."
"Like, it was like some of these people had a literal creepy infatuation with fictional, possessed by child spirits, robots, and that's only some of the crazy stuff I've seen on Wattpad."
"When the first game came out it was simple fun partaking in the fad of a unique new horror game, it's insane the kind of rabid, strange fan base the series has garnered. Not anywhere near what I would have expected."
In short:
"Find. Better. Idols."
- DirePug
There's no reason to become obsessed with a person, character, or game to a point of inciting true violence. No human is above another and that includes celebrities.
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