It's hard to tell who the hero of a story might actually be. Sure, the author might center in on a specific character's arc, hoping we'll feel something for this person they've obviously invested a lot of time into. And, sure, we might leave the movie or finish the book thinking that character was heroic. With the passage of time, however, it becomes a little more obvious the individuall we were supposed to be rooting for was a horrific monster the entire time.
Reddit user, u/darkp25, wanted to hear who we should actually hate when they asked:
Itsa Me, A VILLAIN.Giphy
Mario. Lets Yoshi die to save himself, plays around with other women, kills thousands of Mushroom Kingdom citizens that have been turned into blocks, is a complete ahole towards his brother, etc. etc.
Cigars Can't Hide Actions Behind The Senes
The monster, the mass murderer is still portrayed as a hero in western countries.
Winston Churchill committed some atrocities to the Scottish people, but so has every other U.K. government since, so we're kind of used to it now.
To Be Fair, EVERYONE From "Watchmen" Is An Awful Human, And That's The Point.
[Rorschach] from WATCHMEN.
He's basically a realistic Batman but he's a complete sexist and homophobic a--hole. He claims to be fair but when a former ally of his said that her mom got raped by another hero called the comedian, Roarshac just shrugs it off by saying that the comedian served his country and that her mom was a whore anyways.
Heard He Was A Big Party Boy, Too
Violates the constitution. Defies the supreme court. Massacres the native american populace by relocating them via the trail of tears.
Gets put on the $20 bill.
This One Has Probably Been Talked To Death Online
Severus Snape. The movies watered this character down extremely. In the books, basically the only positive thing about him is that he's actually a "good" guy. He literally threatens to poison his students in book 4 to test their antidotes, and he fed a potion made by Neville to Trevor, expecting it to kill the frog and when it doesn't he punishes Hermione for helping Neville. He treated Harry horribly right from the get go simply because of his father.
He literally created a spell to make a person bleed out. He may've been on the side of the good guys but he was certainly no tragic hero like the movies made him out to be. He was a self-righteous, pompous, insufferable, arrogant prick.
It's Not Just The MCU. It's ALL Incarnations Of Odin.
If you think about it Odin from the MCU is a dick. He has covered up everything and raised Hela to be a cold-hearted killer and banished her for doing what he wanted. He also lied to Loki about being Asgardian. He made Loki think he could be king. He also got overconfident with Malekith. He also treats people who are not Asgardians like sh!t. He also stole and killed many many people. He raised Thor to be a spoiled brat and got mad at him for it and banished him. He also died when Thor and Loki needed him to help them fight Hela. He's not a hero at all.
Breaking The Law, No Matter How Funny It Is
Robin Williams' character in Mrs. Doubtfire. As a kid, I was mad at Sally Fields for ruining everyone's fun, but as an adult, holy sh-t, Robin Williams' character is the WORST. He sabotages his own career, destroys his house with zoo animals (going behind his wife's back to do so, after specifically being told not to have a crazy party), and literally tries to murder the new guy his ex-wife is dating (Pierce Brosnan's character) by serving him food he's allergic to.
Not to mention the basic plot of the movie, which is establishing a new identity to get closer to his kids whom he's not allowed to be around.
No Update Can Fix That OdorGiphy
Steve Jobs. Despite being worth a tremendous amount of money, he had to be sued for child support. Choosing to not provide for your family makes you a dirt bag.
Apparently he was a smelly dirt bag. Dude never washed because he believed being a fruititarian meant he had no body odour, his coworkers very much disagreed. He was known for being a visionary, but I guess not a smellanary.
From My Point Of View...
Some ancient cult that kidnapped babies to turn them in to magical wizards with laser swords. The whole order were labeled as peace keepers but just turned into war generals serving a corrupt senate run by a f-cking Sith Lord
And Just To Add Insult To Injury
Stop me if you've heard this before.
He joins the rebellion and blows up the Death Star. Although we see it as awesome because he's the "hero", that action would have crippled the galactic economy and sent the government into a frenzy after the death of several important political figures. The Death Star took almost 20 years to build and would've been ludicrously expensive. It's like the 9/11 attacks but on a galactic scale.
And when Vader and Palpatine die, the government goes to complete anarchy after the death of their leaders. Despite the rebels being portrayed as "heroes", they're just a group of violent rebels pulling off a coup. So Luke, Leia, Han and all the rebels are violent criminals who overthrew a pretty stable government and crippled the galactic economy.
For Those In The Back: THE PUNISHER IS NOT A HERO
Same probably as Rorschach from Watchmen. The Punisher is an intriguing character, but not that great of a person, and certainly not a hero. It certainly depends on the writer, Netflix Punisher for example, is a lot more sympathetic than the 2019 run of comics Punisher. I'm sure lots of people fantasize (and carry out) vigilante justice but it's just not sustainable. Add to that at times Frank seems overly sadistic and goes out of his way to torture criminals makes things a bit problematic.
Especially in the world of 2020. This was addressed last year when some cops in the comic had a little "club" with Punisher logos on their cars that supported him (ha like real life!) and the Punisher told them to f-ck off and if they wanted a role model try Captain America. Honestly IMO it might be time to retire the character, give him a noble send off and let it be. Besides, almost every Punisher story is written the same way and ends up getting stale (that's why I unsubscribed from the books).
The fact that a lot of military personnel and law enforcement still to this day wear Punisher logos is a bit disturbing when you think about who it represents.
Doesn't Matter How Many Musical Numbers There Are, Still An Awful Guy.
PT Barnum in the Greatest Showman. Dude was definitely not a nice guy and completely focused on exploiting anyone with strange features.
He touted an old black woman around as George Washington's 160 year old nurse and, when she died, had her autopsy performed live on stage for an audience.
Popular Books. Awful Person.
As a naive kid who didn't understand the concept of an unreliable narrator I thought Greg Heffley from Diary of a Wimpy Kid was pretty cool, as an adult he is a rotten little piece of sh-t.
Yeah. In real life, the way he is in the books, he would just be that one weird ahole that no one likes. Not even bullied, everyone would just hate being around him.
A Long Lineage Of Mistakes
Zeus is a horrible person if you look at the actual Greek myths. Hades is a pretty good dude though.
Zeus was disloyal to Hera and is a rapist and it's treated like a running joke. Hades was loyal to his wife and even the idea that he "kidnapped" Persephone has been mostly discredited in modern translations/interpretations. It's likely one of the most loving and consensual relationships in Greek mythology. All of the gods are flawed and jealous and everything but altogether, Hades (and Persephone) are some of the least so, while Zeus is one of the worst.
How Did We Never Notice This One Growing Up?
Jack from jack and the beanstalk
The guy literally sold his fathers cow for some beans, and then he'd break and enter into the giants home and then MURDER him
Seriously, How Can Anyone Still Idolize That Guy?Giphy
Dude was smart, but a total scumbag.
EDIT: I just felt the need to elaborate a little more on why Edison is trash. But first, some things to know:
Many people will want you to think he stole everything and invented nothing at all, but history is actually a little fuzzy on that. He was a smart man, but most of his influence stems from his vast marketing skill, and deep pockets of cash.
Many inventions that Edison is credited with, were not invented by him, but likely these things would not have been as popular, or widely used or influential without the cash and influence from Edison.
He deserves only trace amounts of credit for helping those good inventions along, because here are (a few) of the reasons Thomas A. Edison was human garbage:
- A popular technique of his was slander. Using his money and influence he destroyed many of his opponents (actual brilliant inventors and their ideas) because he cared more about money than the progression of science and technology.
- In experiments with X-rays, he resorted to irradiating his employees; thankfully he also irradiated himself and almost went blind. Bastard deserved it.
- He did indeed kill elephants, but on top of that, he killed dogs, cats, and other neighborhood pets. He's pay kids in the neighborhood to bring him animals so he could electrocute them to show just how dangerous his competitors' technology was.
- Speaking of electrocution, we have Edison to thank for the electric chair. Another smear campaign to harm a competitor. The first execution took 8 minutes, multiple attempts, and the prisons skin bled and burned. Smell was so bad it's noted in many accounts. According to Edison, 'all the excitement had caused some bungling'
Mid-World War I, Tesla was working on radar. A piece of technology that could've saved many lives, and improved allied military intelligence.(Tesla's theories and research for radar, and further development was rejected, not radar itself.) When presented to the US Navy's head of Research & Development (none other than the pile of trash we call Thomas Edison) prevented the further R&D of radar. Later on this research would be the backbone for the actual development of radar in the 30's.
I'm sure there are more stories, but these are the ones I am aware of. I hope history will one day look upon Edison in the way he deserves.
I think back to my third grade class where we learned how important his contributions were, and how he gave us the lightbulb! Hogwash. The man was scum, and glorifying him is a gross misrepresentation of his impact.
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When looking at a resume, it's easy to understand how prospective employers will assume someone is very intelligent based on their education and past experience.
But one shouldn't only assume someone's intelligence based on what they read.
More often than not, one can tell rather quickly that someone possesses above-average intelligence, based on how they speak, how they behave, or other telling details.
Redditor PadWanKenobi was curious to hear what people felt were the tell tale signs they were in the company of a possible genius, leading them to ask:
"What’s a sign of extremely high intelligence?"
"Ability to intuitively and quickly understand complex systems and how lots of parts relate in a coherent whole."
"Like I work with some people who just keep tons of concepts in their head and easily integrate new information into their understanding of those concepts."
"They immediately know what questions they should be asking to better understand."
"And these are things they're currently working on, not like things they spent time studying in school over years."
"They just have a very strong ability to synthesize new information into their understanding."
"I sit in meetings distracted and confused having forgotten what we talked about in the previous meetings, and these folks just consistently have a solid handle on everything."- Ok-Control-787
Innate Problem Solvers
"They know when not to solve a problem."
"This took me a while to understand but the smartest people I know do this."
"It could be a really simple thing like ignoring emails from people asking for help."
"The supervisor or boss might have a quick and easy solution for the situation but instead of just handing it to the person that asked they let them figure it out on their own."
"They know who they can do this with and when to do it."
"If they did that with all of their underlings it would just create a mess."
"Another example that I can think of is planned chaos."
"Some people can predict exactly where things will go wrong and they could fix it before it creates a problem."
"They don't because nobody ever notices what's going on in the background when things are working perfectly."
"Once things fails then everybody notices and if you are the one person that fixed it you become the hero."
"They can also use then chaos to reach a goal they couldn't get before if things were working correctly."
"There's many examples of this in every day life that I didn't see before until I realized what was happening."- atapesGiphy
You know what they say about people with small hands
"If your hand is smaller than your face."- FallofTheKnight
The all knowing glow.
"When someone asks you a question and you push your glasses up while light comes out of it and covers your eyes for some reason."- JonEregor
Those giveaway behavioral quirks
"Wearing glasses and saying things like 'ah yes', and 'I see' while you pensively rub your chin."- iuytrefdgh436yujhe2Thinking Reaction GIF by ABC TV + IVIEWGiphy
"When they explain something they make the people around them feel smarter, not dumber."- redkat85
Being one step ahead.
"The capacity to understand complex things, see patterns where regular people don't."- Ostepop234
"They have this tendency to make you go 'Ohhh, why didn't I think of that?' when listening to them talk."- did_it_forthelulzWhy Didnt I Think Of That Cillian Murphy GIFGiphy
An endless love of learning
"A passion for knowledge and expanding understanding of complex concepts."
"The plumber can be just as insightful as the scholar."- KatatoniK94
Of course, one shouldn't always be fooled by what they see.
As many people are masters at appearing much smarter than they are.
In fact, one important sign of super intelligence is being able to separate those who appear smart, from those who actually are.
With each passing year of a marriage, couples will often discover that while they don't love each other any less than they once did, that spark their relationship used to carry has faded.
This will often lead these couples to look for ways to spice things up a bit.
Among the more popular experiments is inviting a third member to their bedroom.
Enticing as this prospect is, however, it's also easy to be intimidated by the reality of it, or even the mere suggestion of it.
"Men, what advice do you have for men whose wives want to bring a third into the bedroom?"
Make sure you want to do it.
"You need to be completely honest with yourself, ask if this is something you want and could live with."- Dame87
Proceed with caution
"It’s like frolicking in a mine field."
"You both better be SUPER into the idea, you can’t have one person who’s reluctantly agreed to go along with it."
"And established rules."
"A threesome sounds like fun and games until you’re watching your partner make faces and sounds that you only thought were for you in your most intimate moments together, and a burning jealousy comes out of nowhere and breaks your heart."
"I’m not saying it’s automatically a bad idea and I know people do polyamory successfully, but dear god be careful."- coleosis1414
Make sure you're an active participant
"I had an ex that was adamant that she wanted to be a swinger or whatever."
"The one time I decided to roll with it, I hit it off immediately with the other dude's girlfriend and had a blast hanging out with her all night."
"The other dude was a total creep, though."
"Also, my ex could not handle the fact that someone else was giving me the slightest bit of attention."
"So, needless to say, that didn't go anywhere."
"Turns out she didn't want to be a swinger, she just wanted to have sex with other people behind my back, which she had no problems whatsoever with."- Ted_Denslow
Look out for ulterior motives
"Just remember that if you bring this up and your husband is against it, that could be the beginning of the end of your marriage."
"For a lot of people their partner saying 'I am seriously considering having sex with other people and I'm checking with you if it is ok', is a deal breaker."- gamerplays
Consider a test run?
"Go to a bar together separately."
"Watch them flirt/interact with someone else."
"If you get jealous, it's probably a bad idea to bring in a third."
"If it turns you on, go for it."- SinSlayer
Query people with experience.
"It’s something my wife and I have talked about."
"We both agreed that opening the Pandora’s box is not the way we want our relationship to go."
"While it sounds fun, we have seen way to many relationships derailed because of it."- DarthDujo
Consider going whole hog.
"Bring a 4th."- xxemrgmi
Evaluate your relationship first.
"Make sure you and your partner are secure in your own relationship before having another person join."
"Have boundaries, and no secrets."
"From my experience it doesn't usually work out in the end."- Thick-Procedure455
"Don't do it."
"For a long time, my ex harbored a fantasy of watching me have sex with another woman."
"Hey, who knows why any of us are wired the way we are?"
"After contemplating the idea together for a while, we decided to approach one of her more attractive co-workers, who had made a series of flattering comments along the lines of "you're so lucky" and "he's so good-looking'."
"She enthusiastically agreed."
"Our first meet-up was of course awkward, but the second, third and following were pretty good."
"In fact they got progressively hotter, as we all got more comfortable with each other's boundaries, erotic likes and dislikes."
"However, over a few months these occasional kinky weekends transitioned into the co-worker asking more frequently and aggressively to be invited over."
"We tried to explain that we had intended these threesomes to be rare and exotic highlights in our sex life, not regular occurrences, but she didn't take the message to heart and instead became increasingly insistent, bordering on smothering."
"After being turned down one Friday, that night she unexpectedly showed up at our door anyway, carrying a weekend bag and wearing nothing but a raincoat, stay-ups and heels."
"While that was quite a sight, it definitely creeped us out, as it made us finally realize the whole arrangement was descending into 'play Misty for me' territory."
"My ex and I agreed that her unexpected and unwelcome appearance signaled the end of future three-ways, at least until we were able to cool our own selves down, reassess, and perhaps later find a less demanding and insistent third."
"Things subsequently got very sticky at work for my wife, as her co-worker, with whom she had to interact closely, strongly resented being permabanned, and kept demanding to know 'what she'd done that was so awful'."
"Coworker eventually asked to be transferred to another office, but by the time that process was over and done, the discomfort / guilt / pressure / confusion my ex was suffering both at home and at work had begun to take its psychological toll."
"I must confess it didn't help that our own sex life was simultaneously going through a rough patch."
"Long story short, we ended our decade-long relationship less than a year after breaking off the threesomes, chiefly due to trust issues and growing sexual incompatibility, both perhaps triggered by our experimentation."
"Ever since, I've regretted agreeing to that first three-way."
"If I hadn't been so damned eager to take a bite of forbidden fruit, we might have kept our relationship intact."
"But I guess this can also be put down as what sometimes happens when you ignore that old advice, 'don't sh*t where you sleep'."- theartfulcodger
When venturing into the unknown, it's always wise to gain some first hand experience, to hear a variety of pros and cons of what you're possibly getting yourself into.
That way, deciding whether or not it's for you will become increasingly clear.
It's also important to remember, that it is always ok to say "no".
People Share Their Best 'You Either Die The Hero Or Live Long Enough To Become The Villain' Experiences
"You either die the hero or live long enough to become the villain."
Though not necessarily a universal truth, all of us have witnessed unfortunate moments in our lives where we've seen this saying become a reality.
Be it seeing our favorite public figures take a serious fall from grace, someone we know and admire eventually disappointing us in a devastating manner, or even seeing ourselves turn into someone we promised we'd never become.
One Redditor was curious to hear people's examples of this saying coming to light, either from a personal experience or seeing it happen to a well-known, public figure, leading them to ask:
"Who is your example of 'you either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain'?"
"He originally stood up for civil rights when it was really unpopular."
"Was hospitalized and accidentally placed in the black ward."
"When the doctors found out, they tried to move him, but he refused."
"Then he became a cult leader and used his power and influence to end the lives of a thousand people."- Crvsby
Earning a position of power
"Working in restaurant kitchens."
"You either burn out young, or become the boss that everyone hates."
"There's exceptions, but that's the rule."- grandpas_old_crow
"Henry Heimlich, inventor of the Heimlich Maneuver."
"Made up a bunch of untested uses for it, treating people having asthma attacks, and drowning victims were the two I remember that he publicly talked up."
"Later, he funded an experiment that involved injecting people with Malaria to see if it would treat other conditions.
"The experiment was found to be unethical by American review boards, so he conducted them in Ethiopia." - User Deleted
"In WW1 he led the French to victory at Verdun, one of the worst battles in human history."
"In WW2, after France was beaten, Petain was the head of state of Vichy France."
"Guy went from the Lion of Verdun to the biggest Nazi collaborator in France."- arthuranymoredonuts
"Every organ until it gets cancer."- SuperBaconjam
"He had the whole country behind him here in Ireland at one point bar people who thought combat sport is grotesque."
"He was witty, original, backing himself up and having a Hollywood like rise to stardom."
"Now he's someone who the whole country is ashamed of, goes punching old men, clearly sleeps around on his wife while she's at home with the kids, just a walking caricature of himself."
"He didn't listen to his own advice."
"Get out."- StephenPigot2020
Turning into our parents
"My dad used to annoy me by calling my Pokemon cards 'Pokey-Mans'."
"Now my kids have them and I do the same thing and it annoys the sh*t out of them."
"Thanks for the (Pokeyman) gold!"- rumpel4skinOU
"Almost died during the revolutionary way, if I recall correctly, and if he had he would have been remembered a huge hero, and a martyr."
"Instead he lived and changed sides, and is remembered only for his being a traitor."- uniqueperson22
Be it someone we knew quite intimately, or someone we admired from a far, it is always heartbreaking to see someone evolve from someone we love, to someone we utterly hate.
Sometimes we do things that have to be done.
And some of those things live in life's gray area of right and wrong.
What comes as a surprise to some is when we don't care if we're wrong.
We may still technically be in the right.
But morally and ethically, there may be some issues.
But still, many people don't care.
Redditor BirdyPizzawanted to see who would fess up about some of the worst things we're responsible for but have no shame.
"What is the darkest thing you have ever done and don’t regret?"
I've stolen from department stores that overcharged. I was arrested. I didn't care. So there...
"Five years ago my dad suffered a catastrophic stroke. Left paralyzed and robbed of his speech and ability to communicate he was a shell of the once vibrant, charismatic man he once was. He was moved into skilled nursing where he lived for nearly two years, he was miserable."
"On my last visit I told him it was okay if he wanted to leave us, that we would miss him but he should go. A week later I received the call that he had passed. Instead of immediate grief I felt relief. Relief that he was finally free. The grief came later and I still miss him every single day."
"Got into a car accident and had to stay with my mom for a couple days to figure out what to do. Went back to my apartment (I had two roommates) and everything was missing from my room. Long story short one of my roommates had everything hidden in her room."
"I called and told her the things were missing from my room and she came up with a lie that a couple girls came to look at my room (I was moving out bc of the accident, long story) and that they must have taken my things. She had everything I owned. Including my grandmothers perfume bottles, stuffed to the back of her closet, under her bed, behind her dresser etc."
"So I packed all of my stuff up. Then took a giant black garbage bag and stuffed as much of her closet in it as I could. Took it to the middle of nowhere, dug a hole and burnt it. She called screaming at me that her stuff was missing. I told her the two girls must have come by and taken her stuff too."
"I hit my uncle left right and center when he was trying to choke my father to death. I was 16 years old at that time, a very skinny girl. I beat his face neck and every part of him that I could target with so much intensity that my knuckles turned blue the next day. I had an animalistic rage that day trying to help my father get away from his death grip. I hate my uncle even today."
"I got anger issues because of growing up around him. And I don't regret beating him that day at all. He was physically abusive to his wife as well. One fine day, his wife retaliated by beating him blue with a stick. And he stopped being physically violent towards her post that."
"A neighbor like 10 years ago was neglecting their dog badly in the heat. The dog escaped often and ended up at the shelter a lot. One day she jumped the fence and got her tie-out cable stuck on the fence. (She was not in danger of choking.) Neighbor put her on a 3-foot-long cable tied to a doorknob, no water, 90 degree day. I let some kind folks steal her, watched the whole thing and said nothing to stop them."
"When my father was dying and in pain I was the one who told the doctors he had been through enough and we couldn't see him suffer anymore. Doctor injected him with something, I assume a morphine mega dose and he passed peacefully moments after. Euthanasia may not be legal in UK but compassionate doctors know what's what. I don't regret it because my pa made me promise I would have his back when he got sick or old. I'm sad he got sick and never got to get old."
That is a lot of mess. But sometimes we have to do what we have to do.
"One of my ex best friends in high school was a real narcissistic lunatic. Had so many egotistical fantasies about what he deserved but I remained his friend because we met through my close friend (his girlfriend). As I started realizing what a terrible person he was I convinced him to go after his fantasy of a harem by asking to add a 3rd to their relationship, that led to a fight between his gf."
"I called her about it and asked how she felt about him adding someone to their relationship and about him sleeping with her. She said she knew nothing about that and started crying because he cheated on her. I basically helped orchestrate their breakup and have no regrets. She is happy with her first child now and he is in a toxic af relationship with 3 kids, 2 of which aren't his and his partner is 8 years older than him."
"Had to make the choice to take my dad off of life support after he got Covid this year. He was sedated for a couple of weeks and one of his lungs collapsed and I couldn't watch him fall apart anymore. My dad was a bulky dude. Constantly did a lot of outdoor work and to see him bone skinny and have no muscle left killed me and I knew even if he somehow got through it, he would have been so miserable and depressed in that state he was in. I don’t regret it. I think it was the right thing to do by him. I’ll never not miss him though. That was my buddy."
"Turned a close friend into the fish and game. He would poach mountain lions and bears. His whole family would literally shoot them and leave them. He would brag about it. I couldn’t stand it and felt that I needed to stop him. He’s in prison and so is his uncle. I know I ruined his life but he was literally killing so many mountain lions and bears."
"In middle school, there was this group of boys that would corner me in the hallway and try to scare me. I was the perfect target for these little b**tards. I was short, skinny, and had (and still have) and anxiety disorder. One day I just had enough, and asked a friend if I could have an extra pencil, sharpened it as much as I could, and when I saw one of them in the hallway, I stabbed the hell out of his leg. Sh**head got what he deserved."
Wow... we really are a dark and secretive people.